December 15, 2002 EhBC Online Discussion

<ModBot> This message is generated by Moderator Bot, ModBot for short. I've set an automatic message that reads as follows...
<ModBot> Welcome to or regular Sunday night discussion. Please refrain from sending "hi" and "bye" messages until after 10 pm. Also note that the discussion is being logged. If you wish to remain anonymous, you should change your nick. Tonight's discussion topic is "BDSM in the New Millennium". The discussion is unmoderated. Enjoy!
<cynde> that is true, you are not lurking about in the shadows much these days `T
* cynde smiles
<cynde> hello Jusitce
* cynde smiles
<Justice> hello cynde
* cynde smiles
<Justice> bdsm in the new millenium? why would a calendar change precipitate a change in practice?
<cynde> possibly over time as we age and advance we become more accepting
<KingJ> hi A/all
* alice_in_chains scratches her head, i agree with Justice
<ravenswolf> why did a calander change precipitate mass panic
<cynde> and as W/we are creature of time, this makes it seem like time issue
<Justice> looks like the topic is not a popular one - anyone have any suggestions for a new one?
* cynde giggles
<Symmetre[t]> sorry ... what is the topic?
<ravenswolf> BDSM in the New Millennium
<cynde> hello Symmetre[t] Sir
* cynde smiles
<Lady_Meadows> what does that topic mean????
<Cassity^> good evening
<cynde> hello Cassi
* cynde smiles
<Cassity^> hey cynde
<cynde> how did you work efforts go this afternoon Cassi
<Cassity^> they went not to bad
<Cassity^> got the flogger with only knots to do and the whip handle all braided
<cynde> very nice
<Cassity^> not to mention visited with Gem and cableguy and cooked a yummi roast diner
<cynde> was tempted to join you
<cynde> but with the snow
<cynde> and not having your phone number
<Cassity^> yes its still snowong here
<cynde> i was kind of stuck at home
<cynde> lol
<yummy> so is there bdsm in the new millenium?
<ravenswolf> damn i sure hope so
<yummy> i do too
<yummy> else what is it i've been up to?
<cynde> well we are in the new millenium
<cynde> and bdsm is still here
* cynde smiles happily
<yummy> or you ravenswolf ......what have you been up to if not bdsm?
<ravenswolf> lol yes but the millenium is still veryyyyyyyyy young
<Symmetre[t]> its only a matter of time till there's a bdsm channel on digital cable ... order now!
<Cassity^> lol
<yummy> full of 24/7 of kink? please save me
<yummy> has it changed in the few years since the 1990's??
<Symmetre[t]> don't laugh yummy .... our world is going to become more media-intensive ... and nothing's going to escape being swept up in that .... for good or bad
<Symmetre[t]> it's only a matter of time till we see advertising on toys
<yummy> it already is, imagine communicating like this 20 years ago
<SirGriz> it's called brand names
<cynde> do you think advertising will help make more aware and help others accept the feeling they hide from themselves
<SirGriz> I don;t think so it's meant to sell things
<yummy> i can see the nike swish on the single tail now
<yummy> and the sub screaming "just do it"
<Symmetre[t]> advertising is meant to squeeze the last penny out of someone ... no other purpose
<SirGriz> lol
<cynde> yes meant to seel, but helps make others aware they are not the only ones
<Symmetre[t]> no shit ... lol ... Nike singletails
<cynde> lol
<cynde> you could add those to your site Symmetre[t]
<cynde> lol
* cynde smiles
<yummy> well paddles would need to be by an earthier company
<yummy> sponsered by Domtar?
<SirGriz> branded by an imprint of Domtar on it?
<SirGriz> lol
<yummy> something like that
<yummy> we don't even want to think who is gonna do the fire play sponsorship
<SirGriz> domtar on the bottom of your
<Symmetre[t]> joking aside ... I can see bdsm becoming far more visible in mainstream society in the so-called new millenium
<Cassity^> bic
<SirGriz> it is now with some of the Prob Dommes sometimes makeing the news advertising the new opening of their Dungeons
<cynde> or being arrested and going threw the courts over a Dungeon
<SirGriz> I remmeber one a few years ago located on Jarvis street made the news
<SirGriz> yeah that too
<cynde> making such a name that the news is present when you pick up your so called eveidence in the case
<SirGriz> and some sun on his knees getting a spanking with a crop
<SirGriz> sun=sub
<cynde> in a maid outfit, looking so well groomed
* cynde smiles
<Cassity^> hey abi
<SirGriz> Pro Domme in her leather
<SirGriz> imagine if the Pro was a male what would be said?
<cynde> sad but true
<cynde> women are given more freedom
<yummy> how many male pro Doms are they?
<cynde> but then when a male fantasy comes true
<cynde> it is accepted
<Symmetre[t]> on one hand ... bdsm becoming more visible in the mainstream is a good thing ... it lets people know this is okay and responsible and we're not a bunch of weirdos ... it helps someone who is dom or sub to accept that in themselves
<SirGriz> and on the other?
<Symmetre[t]> on the other ..... going public with bdsm, as it were, will inevitibly water it down a bit .... by attracting negative attention too
<SirGriz> you think it waters down with the newbies enetering now?
<workinhardd> aslong as that is the image that the producers wish to project. If they want to make us sleezy wierdo's they'll do that to
<SirGriz> I'ma relative newbie
<Sweet1`> it already had the negative attention
<workinhardd> any one see the show "KINK" on Bravo last night?
<cynde> negative attention because some are not willing to view with an open mind
<SirGriz> well thos that make movies do what they want with the truth even with someone's biography Wwe all know that so this is nothing new
<workinhardd> deffinately negitive image for people like us
<Symmetre[t]> I don't think it "waters down" things, SirGriz, if the people are sincere. But I thnk that the awareness of bdsm does attract a lot of people who come into it with the wrong intentions ... mainly clueless wannabe male doms who think oh yeah, the babes have to do what you say
<Symmetre[t]> and those clueless wannabe's poison the well
<SirGriz> I agree
<Sweet1`> things have watered down...moreso in the public arena since you can't do this or that, and for many that's all they see and learn
<Sir_StephenS> there are negative aspects or situations to bdsm, same as any other; have to take the good with the bad
<Cassity^> good evening Omy_and_oasis
<Cassity^> nice to see you again
<cynde> it does help now that the internet opens the world to those who wish to find sites and study to answer the questions
<Symmetre[t]> greater awareness of bdsm is mainly a good thing. Sir_StephenS is right .... there is good and bad though
<SirGriz> I would not have entered this lifestyle if it wasn't for the internet
<Cassity^> me neither
<SirGriz> it is a convenient way to find out things and waaay easier
<Cassity^> nor woudl i have found such a amazing community to jon and build with
<Cassity^> within
<SirGriz> Me too cassity
<cynde> threw the internet i fould mirc and found like minded in my own area, that has been so rewarding being a northern hick
* cynde smiles
<cynde> hi jewel
<Cassity^> lol cynde
* cynde grins at Cassi
<cynde> is that not true Cassi
<SirGriz> well the only reason I use mirc is to come into this chat....lool
<cynde> i chat on Mirc
<cynde> my reference was to munches, fet nights SirGriz
<cynde> my connection to the lifestyle is threw my Mistress, who lives in Ottawa
<cynde> i am being called to the front door
<cynde> bbl
<Cassity^> bye for now cynde
<SirGriz> I see what you mean cynde
<Symmetre[t]> so how long will it be till we start to see bdsm toys shoing up in more mainstream stores? Adult stores already sell floggers and handcuffs
<Cassity^> yuppp
<humblemouse> Greetings
<Cassity^> hell value village here sold floggers crops and lil whips at halloween
<Cassity^> how more mainstream can you get
<`abi> well, the hardware store has always been mainstream
<SirGriz> only for that time though
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> They carry more then just that...but I doubt you'll see voilet wands anytime soon
<SirGriz> if you look you can make any mainstream store a toy store
<Symmetre[t]> Value Village?
<Symmetre[t]> lmao!!
<SirGriz> i was shopping with My dad a few weeks ago in the dominion near him
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> Those would be costume pieces Cassity^..not floggers and whips one would actually use on someone
<SirGriz> Wwe were having fun figuring out what could be toys or
<SirGriz> yes value village too Wwe don;t have one here that I know of
<Cassity^> still .. they are in the store and ppl know what they are about
<Cassity^> costume or not they represent this community
<Cassity^> do they not?
<Symmetre[t]> I can see it now ... Attention Wal-Mart Shoppers ..
<SirGriz> lol
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> pervertables aside, it would be nice to see some quality toys that one would actually use on someone being offered at adult stores
<Symmetre[t]> most of the ones I've seen have been pretty crude, Omy_and_oasis{Omy} ... good point
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> I don't think so Cassity^.
<SirGriz> I seen some better quality from the kink fair at the Werks than I have at toy stores
<Cassity^> ok fair enough..
* Cassity^ smiles
<SirGriz> for a lot less money too
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> kink fairs cut out the middleman SirGriz
<Cassity^> of course.. you will always get better quality from a lifestyle cratsperson
<Symmetre[t]> there were some incredible bargains at the kinky craft fair this year .... excellent quality stuff
<SirGriz> I wasn't able to go this year........I wanna go in the spring when they have the next one
<Sweet1`> this fair was definitely one of the best
<cynde> back
<Symmetre[t]> so that's one plus to bdsm in the new millenium ... greater availability of toys!
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> oasis: what the internet has done is shrink the distancs between those in the lifestyle...bringing us closer...making us feel less and less isolated. Making it feel more like a community
<Symmetre[t]> agreed, Omy_and_oasis{Omy}
<Cassity^> wb cynde
<cynde> thank you Cassi
<cynde> good point Omy_and_oasis{Omy}
<drauma{M}> its _IS_ a community
<cynde> is that not a wonderful thing
<cynde> the family growing
<cynde> finding brothes and sister we did not know we had
<SirGriz> I wouldn't be chatting with you otherwise
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> oasis: also gets those on the fringe the ability to test the waters in a environment where they have control.
<drauma{M}> sometimes much more than borthers n sisters
<cynde> maybe not have control, but explore the option of control
<cynde> was a medifor drauma
<cynde> but yes sometime much more
<drauma{M}> there is control of a sort
* cynde grins
<drauma{M}> my first opportunity to 'top' came in cyber
<drauma{M}> the guy who was my bottom didnt have to stay in his fetter, but he opted to
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> cynde: your misreading...its not the exploration of BDSM we are refering to but the ability to quickly and safely get out of any situation at the click of a button
<cynde> having no doubts about being bottom i never wished to explore being top, but that is a good experience for you drauma
<cynde> oh thank you Omy_and_oasis{Omy}
<cynde> should have not left and come back i gues
* cynde smiles
<Cassity^> evening Bernie
* Cassity^ smiles
* BernieRoehl smiles and waves
* BernieRoehl settles in for the tail end of the discussion
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> oasis: tackle gropes Bernie
* BernieRoehl smiles and gropes oasis in return
* BernieRoehl gathers the discussion isn't too lively tonight?
<drauma{M}> males can be sluts too
<SirGriz> not if Wwe are groping
* BernieRoehl waves hi to ModBot
<drauma{M}> oops
<Cassity^> lol practice for next years Northern Lights Groping contest are we!!
* Cassity^ grins
<SirGriz> I don;t dare;
<BernieRoehl> We're hoping to make it to that. Things will be a lot easier in the new year
* Symmetre[t] will be a groper next time ... not a gropee
<SirGriz> as with all of us?
* cynde smiles
<Cassity^> thank you Symmetre we really appreciated your stepping to the plate on that
<drauma{M}> might help if the greeting messages included a clue as to the topic
<BernieRoehl> They do, drauma{M}. Or at least, they should.
<Cassity^> watch for details of Jan 19th Northern Lights munch in Barrie .. it is the Cherry Worshiping munch,
<Symmetre[t]> glad my ass could be of service
* BernieRoehl checks -- he got a welcome message when he joined the channel, that listed the topic
<Cassity^> thats the next one .. with a sstem tying compitition
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> we didn't Bernie\
<Cassity^> hello Sarcastica
<Cassity^> nor i Bernie
<BernieRoehl> Hmm... interesting. Let me try leaving and coming back.
<drauma{M}> well, ok, on fourth reading I see it
<Sweet1`> i got it when i came in
<Sweet1`> the discussion was in progress then
<cynde> so did i
<BernieRoehl> Just left and re-joined, and I got it
<Cassity^> * Topic is '* BDSM in southwestern Ontario. Visit our website at *'
<Cassity^> thats what i got when i stumbled in
<Symmetre[t]> me too
<Cassity^> my first visit to you all here on bondage
<Cassity^> welcome
<Sweet1`> was it before 9 Cassity^?
<Cassity^> nope
<Cassity^> was after
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> We were here after 9 and got the same msg as Cassity^
<SirGriz> Me too
* `abi got the modbot message
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> anyways..this is getting off topic...any last thoughts on what the topic was
<`abi> after the channel message
<drauma{M}> I think the internet may have taken us too far, we need to be careful now
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> bbias
<drauma{M}> too easy to fall in love wiht peoples so far away that consumation remains unfillied wish
<drauma{M}> unfulfillable
<Symmetre[t]> I don't know about that drauma
<drauma{M}> its hapenning to me now
<Symmetre[t]> I know several couples who met online ... in some cases, getting together demanded a cross country move
<Symmetre[t]> some of these people are married now
<drauma{M}> and, what happens when they find it doesnt work?
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> I got a question...we all talk about BDSM in the NEW millenium...but when did it start? What is the birthdate of modern BDSM?
<ModBot> There are only about five minutes left in the formal part of tonight's discussion. Does anyone have any last-minute thoughts on the subject?
<drauma{M}> Before I met MzTyger there was a Domme in Vegas
<cynde> not really a birthdate Omy_and_oasis{Omy}, is more a maturing i think
<BernieRoehl> Good question. The answer is different depending on what part of the world you're in.
<Symmetre[t]> that's a very good question Omy_and_oasis{Omy} .... I'm prone to think with the widespread growth of the internet
<drauma{M}> and, when I went looking for polyamorous personalls boards, the only one I found was in australia
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> That is a possibility cynde.\
<cynde> as we mature we learn to accept what is
<worshippingslave> hello
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> try swinging clubs drauma{M} there are 1,000's of them
<drauma{M}> the growth of the internet began wiht colleges, as they built more and more open labs it opened up the internet to non-cs types
<BernieRoehl> The organized BDSM community dates back to the late 1940's, though obviously people have been fantasizing and playing for a lot longer than that. The "modern" era does (I believe) coincide with the arrival of the web.
<SirGriz> like in and around 1996 Bernie?
<BernieRoehl> Yeah, 1996 sounds about right
* worshippingslave smiles at MistressSarcastica
<SirGriz> I got online in the fall of 96
<drauma{M}> one suspects the courts of the crowned heads of the world have always been a place for kinky sex
<Omy_and_oasis{Omy}> Seems awful late Bernie...I recall being involved in the 80's online
<SirGriz> best place for
<drauma{M}> mid 80's for me
<drauma{M}> at University of MD
<BernieRoehl> Right, I've been online since 1981, but before 1996 there weren't many web sites about BDSM
<SirGriz> not in the form Wwe are used to though?
<worshippingslave> you sure bout that information BernieRoehl??
<Symmetre[t]> Compuserve and other forums have existed for years ... I tend to think mid to late 1990s ... at least in terms of widespread use
<SirGriz> it was around that time they went to flat montly rates then lots more got on?
<BernieRoehl> It would be interesting to find out. I know that when we set up the EhBC site back in 1996, there really wasn't much -- and there was a lot of controversy about having a BDSM web site.
<SirGriz> and it became way more commercial too
<drauma{M}> well, as the internet expanded to include systems at home, that began the testing and shaking out period
<ModBot> Well, that's it for the formal part of the discussion. The discussion log is now closed. It should be processed and uploaded to the website soon. Please feel free to continue chatting informallly. Have a good night, everyone!
<ModBot> Thank you to everyone who participated in the discussion.
<drauma{M}> when it was discovered that newsgropups couldnt withstand the onslaught of sex-advertising