September 7, 2003 EhBC Online Discussion

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<ModBot> Welcome to or regular Sunday night discussion. Please refrain from sending "hi" and "bye" messages until after 10 pm. Also note that the discussion is being logged. If you wish to remain anonymous, you should change your nick. Tonight's discussion topic is "Dropping and Aftercare". The discussion is unmoderated. Enjoy!
<Justice> no complaints here
<`TimberWolf> hey OMY ltns:)
<Omy> Hello private_beauty...
<jewel`{F}> here comes the bot
<derien{MG}> hi jewel`{F}` and krista-F
<Omy> Hi Timberwolf..yes it has
<private_beauty> oops did not think we'd started sorry
<jewel`{F}> lol we hadn't
<MasterGuny> thats easy off the bench bitch you are done? No?
<Omy> I understand aftercare...what's dropping?
<MasterGuny> dropping is the depression that can be felt after playing
<MasterGuny> it can be a sub gets very cold etc
<Omy> ahhh that's what it refers to
<MasterGuny> or very out of it
<derien{MG}> like coming back to reality from sub space?
<private_beauty> can happen days after too
<Omy> I consider it all part of aftercare...but okay
<MasterGuny> so it affects imediately..some the next day
<jewel`{F}> dropping doesn't always happen right after a scene either
<MasterGuny> some
<LORDWOLF> I think dropping can happen to the Dom or Dommie too
<Omy> After an intense scene I can take upto a day to fully recover.
<private_beauty> dropping is kind of like pms on steriods, very intense
<jewel`{F}> lol beauty
<private_beauty> i have been known to drop days later
<jewel`{F}> i find dropping can be harder too if there hasn't been time for Master to bring me down at least part way
<MasterGuny> you have to be very careful with of the reasons I don't play casually
<Omy> even fell into the snow one time beauty ;>
<MasterGuny> you are no were to be found when needed
<private_beauty> ummm i errrrr heh heh
<MasterGuny> thats up to who every they are with to deal with alone or with there hubby if he is not their partner etc
<MasterGuny> or others
<Omy> Its something I explain to new can freak you out the first time it happens
<private_beauty> for me , i need my Master but when i was single, it was the person whom i had played with
<Omy> I'm no doctor..but I think its tied to the body chemistry changes that occur during an intense scene
<private_beauty> just needed to feel connected
<janizz> and how about the Top Drop?..whats it like???
<MasterGuny> I have never experianced anything like it
<Omy> Well for a period of time...couple be 30 min could be several hrs, I feel tingly...somewhat disconnected from the world
<LORDWOLF> it to me was like a great depression
<Omy> I don't get the depression though.
<janizz> yeah..i have heard that of others LORDWOLF
<LORDWOLF> like comeing down too fast
* _cassie doesn't get depressed, but does get hypersensitive, and a little moody
<private_beauty> i think i alot of times people have no idea they are experiencing a drop
<private_beauty> nods to cassie
<`abi> that's because an adenaline crash is different from an endorphin crash
<_cassie> how so, abi?
<private_beauty> which do you think happens faster?
<jewel`{F}> i had a weekend alone, nobody home but me, Master gave me some tasks, expectations for that time, due to circomstances beyond His control He was not able to talk me down from what i call subbie mode, and the Monday was hell, i was on the brink of tears most of the day
<`abi> different chemical cassie ... the body responds differently
<`abi> typically, Doms experience adrenaline rushes and submissives experience endorphin rushes
<_cassie> but are both released in any type of intense scene?
* _cassie nods
<jewel`{F}> so i think dropping can happen even with out the play, just the being in the right head space
<_cassie> endorphins are a response to pain, are they not - whereas adrenaline is a response to stress, fear or effort?
<Omy> abi: you can't have both occuring at the same time?
<LORDWOLF> I know you can ben there
<`abi> yes cassie
<`abi> I suppose it's possible Omy, but I doubt that it's typical in a scening situation
<Omy> how do you know which kind of rush your experiencing?
<MasterGuny> they both can have similar resaults on the body
<LORDWOLF> almost cause heart to beat iregular
<`abi> an adrenaline rush will create high energy .... similar to a fight or flight response
<private_beauty> the adrenal rush happens more quickly, produces the sleepy/spacey feeling
<private_beauty> afterwards
<private_beauty> endorphines are more emotional, laughter to tears in 0-60
<janizz> what do you (top or bottom) like to do = help you through - when dropping?
<Omy> I get hungry
<Omy> I gotta eat..have something to drink
<private_beauty> and Your girl Sir?
<jewel`{F}> i like to cuddle
<Omy> of course beauty
<LORDWOLF> scare/ not knowing where one is and what hapen from endorphines cause the the adrenal rush to happen
<janizz> private parties, i tend to have fresh cut fruit, or candy available....for that reason...and there is always beverages
<LORDWOLF> counter action of body and mind not a good feeeling
<private_beauty> What do You do with her other than feed her Omy, Sir?
<Omy> I was talking with someone..can't remember who that said citrus fruit afterwards was a bad idea..
<janizz> like everything what works for whom...
<jewel`{F}> Master always makes sure that there is fresh fruit juice and ice water handy
<Omy> Keep her safe..put a blanket around her...rub her back...let her come back to reality on her own time
<Omy> True enough janizz
<private_beauty> my votes on chocolate lol
<jewel`{F}> lol beauty
<_cassie> water, water, water, water
<private_beauty> nods to Omy but, to all Tops/Doms it is three days later and she is moody as hell then what?
<jewel`{F}> beat me again
* jewel`{F} grins
<private_beauty> lol
<Omy> Ohh well I always give a call the next day, and the day after that.
<MasterGuny> know were it could be coming from and deal with it or note it for next time so you both recognize it for what it is
<private_beauty> awwww MasterGuny Sir that is the key though figuring out what it is and then knowing it for what it is
<private_beauty> not always an easy task, yes?
<MasterGuny> no but it will be like a habit if due to play
<Omy> No its not beauty...but it does make some interesting conversations
<private_beauty> agreed on both counts
<jewel`{F}> Master is very good at giving me the once over after a scene, making sure no harm was done, then i am to email Him the next day, let Him know about any bruising, He will also try to call me to check on the emotional state
<private_beauty> hard part i think to dropping is communication
<Omy> why's that?
<private_beauty> you have to understand what's happening to you
<private_beauty> as, in my case, does my Master
* _cassie nods to jewel
<jewel`{F}> it can be hard to tell someone how or what you are feeling when you are not even sure yourself
<janizz> BernieRoehl, may i pm You?
<LORDWOLF> listening, some do not and
<Omy> ahh yes I see...that's why I think its good to mention it before you play theat they might experience the forarmed and all
<private_beauty> not always easy to tell Him why i'm crying one moment and bitching the next
<BernieRoehl> Sure, janizz
<`abi> timing can be helpful in that regard private_beauty ... debriefing is helpful .. but the best time to do it isn't right after a scene, or two days later when you're crashing
<starla{TDM}> i dont think i experience crashing anymore
<MasterGuny> then you get play sluts that play with everyone and anyone...this is one of the responsabilities of that play
<MasterGuny> they just seem to forget it happens
<`abi> or they have a developed a way to deal with it themselves Guny
<MasterGuny> not if they are unaware it is happening to them or can happen
<MasterGuny> thats all in the communication before
<private_beauty> but the communication should not just be before, it should be ongoing, no?
<MasterGuny> yes
<starla{TDM}> nods to private_beauty
<MasterGuny> but with casual play its the perameters before you play etc
<private_beauty> i still have times that i have no idea i'm dropping, till it is pointed out to me
<MasterGuny> I know of someone that is a manic depresent type play with her and two days later she is suicidal
<private_beauty> agreed on the casual
<_cassie> Then wouldn't it be irresponsible to play with such a person, MG?
<private_beauty> ouch!
<MasterGuny> not if you play casually don't ask the right questions etc
<MasterGuny> if you play with her you deal with it..
<MasterGuny> it is extreme
<_cassie> Well no, if you don't know this person will react that way, it's not your fault they don't tell you. But if it's common knowledge, wouldn't most Dom's avoid a person who has such a severe reaction?
<private_beauty> nods but, MasterGuny Suir what if Your not aware?
<MasterGuny> then don't play with dynamite
<private_beauty> kind of hard , when you find out afterwards
* derien{MG} nods
* starla{TDM} listnes
<MasterGuny> with this sub if you sait and talk to her and get to know her she will tell you
<MasterGuny> sit
<private_beauty> nods
<jewel`{F}> if the sub knows it should she also not be responsible for her mental health and reaction as well?
<MasterGuny> they don't seem to..I know a number of them in the lifestyle....but if you take the time and its not casual its easy to find out
<janizz> i say..just beat me...*l*
<janizz> i can look after myself afterwards........
<`abi> in general, what kinds of things do submissive do to take responsibility for themselves when they know they will experience endorphin crash?
<starla{TDM}> TDM looks after me..always maybe thats why i dont experience the crash anymore
<private_beauty> i used to give warning to those i played with and have a great support system outside the play
<private_beauty> mute point with Master though
<`abi> what about simple things ... like planning a quiet day, writing about how you're feeling, herbal tea.....
<jewel`{F}> myself, if i start to feel that crash, i will try to get myself into some private place, be it my bedroom or someplace i can be alone to cope with it
<_cassie> journaling helps me process a lot of stuff
<AndrewDom> good evening all
<starla{TDM}> but if your crashing shouldnt the Master/Dom be there to help you thru it?
<private_beauty> hopefully
<private_beauty> but, even if He is, what if neither of you know what's happening?
<MasterGuny> I believe he should its part of the resposibility that goes along with playing with that partner
<jewel`{F}> that isn't always possible though, that is part of my going into solitude, Master has given me some exercises to do to help me through it
<`abi> you can also take some responsibility for yourself starla{TDM}
<AndrewDom> I agree with both MasterGuny adn abi
<AndrewDom> but then the question becomes where is the dividing line?
<AndrewDom> and is that talked about before hand?
<yummy> well if i know i'm not going to get enough aftercare and its casual play I normally will decide against the play
<AndrewDom> is there a pattern in the play/scene?
<private_beauty> it all comes back to communication and knowing yourself enoiugh to identify what it is that is happening
<private_beauty> enough even
<_cassie> I don't expect a Dom to "fix" my moodiness following intense play, but I do hope that he's able to recognize it for what it is and deal with it responsibly... and that's exactly what I've experienced thus far.
<janizz> alright a many Tops..when playing the partner a few days later to ask how he/she is?
<AndrewDom> always
<janizz> well thats One
<MasterGuny> when I was looking for a partner..not only did I check but asked her to keep a journal or tell me how they were feeling daily
<janizz> but how about now Guny when you play causally at you call the person a day or so later?
<AndrewDom> ahhhh, that's the point janizz
<MasterGuny> I don't play casually
<AndrewDom> I don't that much...
<MasterGuny> if I played hard with someone other than my partner Yes I would check
<AndrewDom> not casually to know the person first...and know what aftercare value them (and myself) so don't play if I can't offer them aftercare
<AndrewDom> bu tthen don't expect to be there for every little whim either...they do have a responsibility to look after themselves in r/t
<janizz> damn i hate when that happens
<AndrewDom> I'm not a father or parent or escape from r/t
<AndrewDom> in fact, that's another reason I don't play much at fets etc...want to know my sub has a life; is competant in r/t; and can be aninteresting person out of the fet scene
<janizz> tries to listen
* starla{TDM} tries to listen too but fights with her computer
* AndrewDom is waiting to hear what others think/feel
<MasterGuny> I like both I just realize what Im dealing with
* shado is pondering this "life outside of fets idea...what a concept"
<private_beauty> has no life
<janizz> is that the shado i know??
<shado> no
<janizz> k thank you
<silken^flame> is there life outside the fet?
<janizz> Andrew, i have a life outside BDsm ~smiles proudly~
<private_beauty> ponds the thought
<private_beauty> ponders even
* starla{TDM} waves time to go Master wants to sit and have coffee be well
<ModBot> There are only about five minutes left in the formal part of tonight's discussion. Does anyone have any last-minute thoughts on the subject?
<janizz> i have work, a home, and i still have about 15 coffeeshops i need to visit
<AndrewDom> you do janizz??? great!! pray tell...but that's off it for another time
<AndrewDom> beat me to it
<janizz> i was ansering Your question AndrewDom
<AndrewDom> I know...just a little slow on the keys tonight
<janizz> alright...~enjoy~
<private_beauty> so what we have learned is that aftercare does not take place just directly after play
<private_beauty> but can last days afterwards?
<AndrewDom> if you have the right Dom
<private_beauty> nods
<ModBot> Well, that's it for the formal part of the discussion. The discussion log is now closed. It should be processed and uploaded to the website soon. Please feel free to continue chatting informallly. Have a good night, everyone!
<ModBot> Thank you to everyone who participated in the discussion.