July 16 2000 EhBC Online Discussion

<BernieRoehl> I've just set a channel message that reads as follows...
<BernieRoehl> Welcome to our regular Sunday night discussion. Please refrain from sending "hi" and "bye" messages until after 10 pm. Also note that the discussion is being logged. If you wish to say something, but remain anonymous, you should change your nick. We recommend using hebron.in.us.dal.net as your server, to minimize lag. Tonight's discussion topic is "Safecalls". The moderator tonight is BernieRoehl. Enjoy the discussion!
<BernieRoehl> So, welcome everyone!
<BernieRoehl> First off, let me ask... has anyone here *used* a safecall?
* BernieRoehl hopes the answer is yes!
<crysania^> yes i have
<fire^runner> yes!
* Kilted_One has
* dalian raises her hand
<|Karen> yep, once or twice
<kathryn_kw> had it set up .. didnt have to use it :)
<BernieRoehl> Good, good
<|Karen> okay, so....how does everyone set them up?
<BernieRoehl> Has anyone here ever *not* used a safecall, and then wished they had?
<|Karen> kath's comment makes me think we use them differently?
<fire^runner> ummm kathryn_kw i thought safe calls where just that god if someone set up a safe call with me and didnt make the call i would go into panic mode
<crysania^> no
<fire^runner> please explain the definition of a safe call
<|Karen> Bernie?
<BernieRoehl> I'll have a definition in a sec
<kathryn_kw> fire.. it was in place.. and used as such .. but it was a safe situation.. sorry i should have clarified it more :0
* fire^runner waits...wiggles her toes
<dalian> there was one occaision that i had wished that i did....was a foolish mistake
<BernieRoehl> A safe call is simply an agreement to phone someone at a pre-determined time, to let them know you're okay
<BernieRoehl> If the phone call doesn't arrive, it indicates trouble
<fire^runner> ok good..so if a safe call is in place it should be used regardless of how the situation is going..whether it be good..or bad...
<kathryn_kw> it can also include timed calls.. more than one
<kathryn_kw> yupper :)
<|Karen> okay, I get my safety net to call me, instead of me calling them
<kathryn_kw> either way.. its still a safe call
<BernieRoehl> Right, exactly
<fire^runner> i call my safe call but they also have where i am at whom i am with and what number to reach me at
<crysania^> used a safe spotter once, had someone come to the restaurant where i was meeting someone and just keep an eye out
<BernieRoehl> Sometimes it can be quite elaborate, with a different "I'm okay" code phrase for each of several calls
<|Karen> that way the Dom I'm with can't wait til my pre-appointed call is over to turn into Mr.Hyde
<BernieRoehl> Yes, fire, that's essential -- without that information, a safe call is not effective
<BernieRoehl> That's a good idea, crysania
<|Karen> 'cause he doesn't know when the call is coming in, or if it's the only one
<rhisper> hi everybosy
<rhisper> body
<fire^runner> but if one is ok..they say they are ok..a code is needed if things are not ok...
<kathryn_kw> but it should be kept simple.. not too complicated
<|Karen> 'though nowadays, I doubt very much that I'd use one at all
<BernieRoehl> The theory is that someone could have a gun to you're head, saying "say you're okay and that everything's fine". A code phrase used in that case could be dangerous.
<crysania^> but since found it is easier to only meet people who are known and vouched for by the community
<rhisper> My masrer uses colours red orange and green
<rhisper> Master
<canplay> i am wondering if anyone has forgot or could not make safe call, what happened,, did their safe net do what was required of them?
<|Karen> safewords are different, rhisper, then safecalls
<kathryn_kw> whisper that is safe words :) not safe calls :) this is different :09
* fire^runner is ashamed to admit she forget to make a safecall
<rhisper> and constantly asks me what colour are you?
<rhisper> sorry
<fire^runner> within 10 mins they had called me...plus my sitter
* crysania^ usually red in the right places *oops* sorry
<BernieRoehl> That's good, fire -- it means your safecall is working
<kathryn_kw> good for them fire.. you know it works then :)
<kathryn_kw> do we have an echo ? :)
* rhisper embarassed
<kathryn_kw> lol
<fire^runner> true but i felt terrible to have them worry so much
<`abi> don't be rhisper.....safewords are important too ;)
* fire^runner will never ever nope ever forget again
<BernieRoehl> Now, has anyone here *been* someone's safe call?
* `abi raises her hand
* fire^runner rises her hand
* BernieRoehl raises His hand
<`abi> now let's all sway
<rhisper> no whats a safe call?
* BernieRoehl chuckles
<kathryn_kw> sheesh
* Kilted_One nods...we have
* Kilted_One sways to the left
<rhisper> <-------------Dunce
<BernieRoehl> A safe call is simply an agreement to phone someone at a pre-determined time, to let them know you're okay
* fire^runner giggles...
* fire^runner does the wave
<rhisper> hehehhe ok :)
<BernieRoehl> If the phone call doesn't arrive, it indicates trouble
<|Karen> a little more detail, maybe...
<fire^runner> or you are hmm tied up and forgot
<canplay> rhisper,,, you would be dunce if you did not ask what you do not know
<BernieRoehl> For those who have been a safecall, what were your thoughts on it?
<rhisper> like when you meet a girl for a first date?
<|Karen> when you're playing with someone for the first time, a safecall is a handy safety net
<BernieRoehl> Did you find it easy, too much of a burden...?
* canplay nods to rhisper
<BernieRoehl> Yes, rhisper, exactly
<|Karen> in case the person you're playing with is not what they initially seemed
<slut^kat> or fall asleep...
<fire^runner> it was easy
<fire^runner> and not a burden how can someons safety be a burden
<`abi> not a burden Bernie....but it is a responsibility .... heaved a great sigh of relief when the calls came
<|Karen> well....first scene in private, anyway....I think dates are something else entirely
<BernieRoehl> Yes, that was My reaction as well, abi -- huge relief when the calls came
<rhisper> got scars from a loaded cat......will never scene on 1st date ever again
<|Karen> and the whole reason I don't foresee myself using safecalls in the future
<BernieRoehl> Yes, rhisper, one can never be too careful
<|Karen> because I will have _dated_ someone long enough before scening with them to know them
<fire^runner> mine too
<BernieRoehl> And does that make you feel completely safe, Karen?
<canplay> i have used safe calls for date as well Karen
<rhisper> but he wouldnt let me call anyway.....so yeahhhhhhh its a good idea
<fire^runner> but Karne that still doesnt ensure safety..you can date someone for a long time and the scene can still go bad
<Mastr-max> Karen??? wouldnt you use a safecall if you were just meeting someone for the first time, not waiting for a play date necessarily
* Kilted_One reminds everyone about the Texas maniac that met women on the internet and killed them as an example of what can happen
<|Karen> I wouldn't get nekkid with someone that I didn't trust...
<dalian> that is very true firerunner...and can be an unforgettable mistake
<|Karen> at least, not in private :)
<Mastr-max> k
<|Karen> nope, I'd meet new people in public places and leave them there for first dates
<fire^runner> agreed Karen but man oh man if its the first time playing regardless of how long you have known the person or how long you have dated a safe call should be in place...
<Kilted_One> Bernie...a ??? what can be done to limit a person on such a date for the first time when there is a chance of danger..a safe call might let someone know that there is trouble but help might arrive toooo late
<dalian> how many of us at one time have learned to trust someone who eventually was not what they seemed?
<|Karen> why fire^runner?
<BernieRoehl> Good point, KO. However, I've always felt that safe calls are most valuable as a deterrent
<canplay> just because i trust One on a date, does not mean i trust scene, so i still use safe call for first scene even though my dating trust was already established
<`abi> safe calls aren't the only safety concern KO ... other things should be considered as well... safecalls are just part of the safety net
<crysania^> i like it when the person You meets asks if You have to make a safecall, it shows that they care and are also aware of the need
<BernieRoehl> If a play-partner *knows* ahead of time that safecalls must be made, they're (hopefully) less likely to do something nasty
<|Karen> yes, thank you abi....there are lots of other safety measures.
<fire^runner> becasue ppl get different when playing intensities change..moods change...we all talk about being in the sub mode..getting into the mind fuck..well is that not true for a Dom...i know some doms who are great as dates but i would never play with them..there starting point is my point of limit
<|Karen> a sudden personality change will not be stopped by a safe call
<LrdTZ> Whats to stop a Dom from being nice the first couple time you have your safecalls but then changing as he knows your not going to have a safe call today.
<|Karen> how's he gonna know that I'm not?
<BernieRoehl> Ideally, LrdTz, the Dom will never know when a safecall is not expected
<slut^kat> how many of the Doms in here use safe calls when meeting a submissive the first 2-3-4 times?
<fire^runner> i sorry but i am a firm believer in safe calls if one is playing....doesnt matter to me how long you have known the man or women....
<|Karen> how many Doms use safecalls, period?
<BernieRoehl> I've used a safecall the odd time, if it's someone I know *nothing* about
* `abi is starting to relax after 25 years
* canplay smiles at fire^runners question
<Kilted_One> so for it to work as a deterant the meeting couple must first discuss the safecall and that it will be used on the first meeting??
<rhisper> stay well A/all
<BernieRoehl> I think that works best, KO
<|Karen> ok Bernie....if it's a person you do know a bit about, say....you've dated them in way or another...still gonna use a safecall?
<Mastr-max> well I think that if you've dated long enough and you have discussed play then you have developed a trust, one might consider less binding play to start with and work into it
* slut^kat looks at Bernie and does the evil subbie "mua ha ha ha" ;-)))))
* BernieRoehl smiles at slut^kat
<`abi> katiias mua ha ha raises the question of safecalls for Doms....anyone ever make one?
* BernieRoehl thinks "and people wonder why we Doms keep the subbies chained and gagged..." :-)
* slut^kat giggles
* Kilted_One nods to Bernie....agreed wanted to make sure that ppl understood that in order to make it work the meeting partner must know about it ahead of the meeting
<BernieRoehl> Not generally, karen
<slut^kat> ayup, dats what i asked earlier there abi....
<BernieRoehl> (Karen, rather)
<fire^runner> there is always a trust level here and we always trust..the ones that prepare our food (having ecoli i know about this) the others on the road..all we can do is ensure we take steps for our own safety...
<|Karen> thank you, Bernie :)
<slut^kat> everybody wants subs using safecalls for 2-3-4 times fo playing... but do Doms?
* BernieRoehl nods at KO
<`abi> sorry katiias...didn't see it ... my scrolling skills aren't what they used to be
* slut^kat smiles.. np
<LrdTZ> I dont use them but i insist subs do.
<Mastr-max> that doesnt make sense
<BernieRoehl> The risk for a Dom is that the subbie will accuse him of kidnapping, assault, etc even though their play was completely consensual.
<Kilted_One> fur sure kat...I did
<`abi> but aren't Doms also at risk...of false accusations if nothing else
<BernieRoehl> Safecalls reduce that risk by making someone else aware of exactly what is (and is not!) happening
<|Karen> Bernie and I operate similiarily but perhaps for different reasons
<Mastr-max> just wait for the safe call and they go HYDE (to quote Karen)
<slut^kat> why is that LrdTZ?
<BernieRoehl> Yes, exactly abi
<Kilted_One> there are plenty of set ups out there using women as the front to lure would be lovers into the arms of ppl in waiting
<BernieRoehl> Yes, KO, I've heard of that happening
<LrdTZ> Because I don't play with anyone that I don't know in advance and as for the kidnapping rape thing even a safe call won't stop that from happening if its going to hapen thenext day.
<BernieRoehl> So safecalls make sense for both Doms and subs, though I would say that the risks subs face are probably somewhat greater
* Mastr-max nope, had weird situations where i wish i had a number but was out of the country
<|Karen> posh
<BernieRoehl> So for those who have been someone's safecall, what procedure did you use?
* `abi doesn't think psychosis is gender specific
* |Karen agrees with abi
<Sir_Fury> lol
<canplay> not gender but role !
<`shado> was Lizzie Borden Domme?
* BernieRoehl agrees with abi as well, but points out that a bound female submissive is more physically vulnerable than the average Dom
<canplay> who is being cuffed or tied?
<|Karen> what about role?
<spankysub> nick /kelly&sean
<|Karen> a male sub could outpower his Mistress nine times out of ten if he felt he was in danger
<BernieRoehl> Exactly, Karen
<canplay> i don't believe Bernie is speaking male female as much as Dom sub ,, so i agree with Him that a sub is more vulnerable
* Kilted_One insisted that a call be made at a specific time and that the person had to say specific words and respond with specific phrases...and then a follow up call 30 mins later to ensure that the person didnt feel that it was now "safe" to do whatever they wanted cause the safe call had been made
<|Karen> the / goes in front of the word nick, spanky
<BernieRoehl> Yes, subs are more physically vulnerable, and (by and large) female subs even more so
<spankysub> :) thank you karen
<LrdTZ> what do you mean you insisted when the call had to me made KO
<Kilted_One> I set the time of the call before the meeting
<LrdTZ> you set the time of the call for when the sub was to call??
<BernieRoehl> And did you have an address and/or phone number of where the meeting was supposed to take place?
* |Karen shrugs 'I have self-defence training, and I know that that alone isn't an answer....but this goes back to 'I don't play privately with people I don't already know well'
<Kilted_One> the meeting had to take place in a public place and it was a cell phone that was being used
* canplay believes KO is speaking of being the safe call, not being the Dom
<crysania^> cell phones have made life much safer, would not go to meet anyone without it
<|Karen> I may be both female and submissive, but I know how to use a) my brain, b) the public services provided to us all as citizens
* slut^kat agrees with crysania^
<BernieRoehl> Yes, cell phones are great for safecalls
<crysania^> pager comes in handy too, can get someone to page you and if you do not respond sign of trouble
* Kilted_One nods to canplay
<BernieRoehl> Excellent idea, crysania.
* crysania^ just hopes they don't page at the wrong time
<BernieRoehl> And now... a more complex question.
* slut^kat chuckles
<BernieRoehl> What do you do when the call doesn't come?
<canplay> cell phones are great for saftey period ,, arranged call or not :))
<slut^kat> unless its a vibrating pager....
* |Karen thinks of pagers set on vibrate and wonders what a bad time is :)
<arhiannah{R}> lol
<crysania^> call the police
<Mastr-max> bye all nice topic thankyou
* BernieRoehl nods
<BernieRoehl> Okay, and what do we say to the police?
<canplay> it all depends on what was pre-arranged Bernie
<SirBear> lol Karen
<BernieRoehl> Agreed, canplay, but that leaves the question of what should be pre-arranged
<arhiannah{R}> be honest with them....if they're only given half a story...they're hands are tied
<crysania^> let them know it is a BDSM situation first and foremost
<crysania^> where the person was supposed to be
* canplay wonders if that was a pun arhiannah : ))
<BernieRoehl> The concern is that they may not take it as seriously if they hear it's "kinky sex stuff"
* arhiannah{R} winks at canplay..
<crysania^> but it prepares them for if it was just a call that was forgotten, safer for Dom and sub
<`abi> is it necessary to tell them that?
<crysania^> we have all heard of someone who has forgotten to make the call, makes for a nasty situation
<canplay> i have told vanillas to make safe calls when meeting, so no need to really get into bdsm
<BernieRoehl> Good point, crysania
<Mltdwn> you tell them that you would liek them to "check the well being"///youi are afraid your best friend may be hurt....didnt call you when supposed to...on date w/ new guy
<BernieRoehl> Yes, that's true crysania
<|Karen> I think I'd tend to tell them that I was a neighbour concerned about the noises at this location and let everyone figure it out when they get there....would get a more immediate response
<BernieRoehl> That's a good approach, Mltdwn
* canplay nods to Mltdwn
<BernieRoehl> I would add "date with a new guy she met on the internet".
<Mltdwn> then they are abliged to check in on them....or thier up the creek if she is in trouble :)
<canplay> with so much internet meetings, i warn all my friends to use safe calls
<Mltdwn> sure BernieRoehl
<BernieRoehl> That's good, Karen, but if they check into it they'll find you're not really a neighbour
<LrdTZ> He is still going to jail if they are playing and she forgot to call.
<canplay> why is He going to jail?
<|Karen> but the point is that it gets them there, and quickly
<BernieRoehl> If the police show up and the guy is flogging her, he could easily get charged with assault with a weapon
<|Karen> I'm afraid that the other approach would put it in low priority
<canplay> as if He would still be flogging her while opening the door?
<`abi> depends on how good his focus is canplay ;)
<glory{Mlt}> lol abi :)
<crysania^> with the media attention now a days about internet meetings, i don't think the police can afford to put it on low priority
* canplay grins at abi
* |Karen frowns
<BernieRoehl> I think the police would take it seriously
* crysania^ agrees
<Mltdwn> the police have to take it seriously....
<|Karen> internet meetings having high media doesn't change the fact that more traditional methods of violence like rape, murder, robbery, and crashes exist
<Mltdwn> that is thier job
<LrdTZ> police only take what they want to be serious.
<canplay> ok You naw sayers.. what are Y/you suggesting?
<Mltdwn> just tell them to "check on the well being of....." and they will do it
<|Karen> and I'm sure the police are plenty busy with the all of the above.
<LrdTZ> First question, how long have they been missing????
<LrdTZ> Second question? Did you try and contact them first??
<Mltdwn> so you answer them....
<Mltdwn> no big deal...
* canplay smiles to Mltdwn
<LrdTZ> Missing person especially adults have to be missing 24 hours.
<LrdTZ> Unless you suspect foul play
<slut^kat> and you do
<Mltdwn> then they will check....if you tell them you fear someone may be in danger they have to attend at that residence and check
<glory{Mlt}> its NOT a missig person LrdTz
<kathryn_kw> unless there is a legitimate immediate concern for their safety
<Mltdwn> exactly
<Mltdwn> kathryn_kw
<kathryn_kw> smile
<BernieRoehl> That's the key, LrdTZ -- you do in fact suspect foul play
<kathryn_kw> two different kettles of fish :)
<canplay> LrdTZ if You feel this is a problem ,,then what do You feel is the solution Sir?
<LrdTZ> Well I think that safe calls are a great idea and i insist on them but as the Dom you had better remember they need to be made grin.
<`abi> has anyone ever had a safecall not report in....besides firerunner?
<LrdTZ> Yes.
<LrdTZ> I did.
<BernieRoehl> How did you handle it, LrdTZ?
<LrdTZ> and when it was investigated, 2 hours later it came down as OH i'm sorry i got tied up and forgot. in the mean time a lot of ppl were in legal trouble. It took the cops two hours to respond.
<canplay> and what did You tell the police when YOu called them LrdTZ?
<canplay> missing person?
<|Karen> that kind of time frame is exactly why I'd create a story that would get them there quicker then 'check on the well-being of a friend...'
<LrdTZ> that a friend was meeting a person a new person for the first time with the intention of BDSM play.
<canplay> and?
<SeaOfNames> Is this the right place to ask questioins I may have?
<kathryn_kw> after 10 pm seaofnames
<BernieRoehl> Sure, SeaOfNames, but between now and 10 pm they have to be related to the subject of safecalls
<Mltdwn> we are in the middle of a discussion
<SeaOfNames> Thank you very much. I shall return.
<BernieRoehl> After 10 pm, anything goes
<LrdTZ> Oh and just to add to this. They couple involved were not playing at the time the cops did show up, but they asked the submissive if they had been beaten that day and was told yes so the Dom was charged.
<glory{Mlt}> woohoo BernieRoehl
<canplay> and so He should be if police were told He *beat* her
<LrdTZ> Beat her in BDSM play not with his fist.
<LrdTZ> not in an abusive way.
<LrdTZ> the sub gave a smart ass reply to the officer
<BernieRoehl> Now, I'm not clear on whether most police officers are trained to know the difference between the two
* canplay would never use word *beat* to describe any scene
<kathryn_kw> well bdsm per se can still be listed as assault .. whether its consensual or not.. .. from what i understand ?
<BernieRoehl> A smart ass reply to a police officer is generally a bad idea :-)
<LrdTZ> did he flog you with a flogger or did he beat you with a flogger same thing.
<|Karen> I would use the word 'beat' but not to a police officer in a delicate situation
<|Karen> friends who already know what context I'm using it in are something else entirely
<glory{Mlt}> lol LrdTZ :)
<crysania^> are police given any information on BDSM relationships
<glory{Mlt}> night all...ask someone who knows...best advice :)
<canplay> personal choice of wording i guess, i refer to beating as non-consentual myself
<fire^runner> I agree Karen but i know a friend who used the word beat..and i got very defensive about it..was concerning a Dom she played with...beat in this lifestlye is not a good word to use
<BernieRoehl> I'm really not sure, crysania. Good question
<|Karen> maybe we should get a police public relations officer to give a talk to the community?
* fire^runner giggles...sees us starting up a Police information session
<canplay> be paranoid of police if Y/you may, what other choices do W/we have?
<|Karen> ummmm...healthy respect, canplay?
<|Karen> cooperation?
<|Karen> careful wording?
<|Karen> paranoia isn't necessary.
<BernieRoehl> It's probably best not to mention BDSM. If police don't have any knowledge about it, it may just complicate things
<arhiannah{R}> find a KAP professional....my lawyer is and has assisted me greatly in my sep/div....not that my kink was an issue....
<kathryn_kw> well a police information session actually sounds like a good thing if we could get it arrangeed :)
<Opal``> i am sure police have to take that kind of accusation seriously... just like teachers if a student says something about a parent
<canplay> does not have all night to find perfect politically correct wording for all, i was just trying to find other methods
<arhiannah{R}> if you set out trying to "hide" it from them, they tend not to be so cooperative
<fire^runner> I just finished a law course and the movie tops and bottoms was brough up...regardless if we consent or not being hit via a flogger a hand a whip a paddle is ILLEGAL
<fire^runner> the officers according to the law have to make an arrest
<kathryn_kw> yeahh that was my understanding fire
<arhiannah{R}> right
<`abi> but without testimony, there isn't exactly a case fire^runner
<canplay> i had heard a group of Doms discussing a group be formed to help out in safecalls missed, i liked that idea
<kathryn_kw> discretion is the byward :)
<fire^runner> you in turn plead BDSM to the judge
<fire^runner> i dunno about all Doms but i bet most wouldnt want to be arrested...
<Opal``> yep... their hands are tied
<`abi> the justice system frowns on officers making arrests that can't be substantiated in court
<Opal``> the bruises can be substantiated
<`abi> not if you refuse to have them photographed they can't
<Opal``> it is still a messy situation
<`abi> I think the important thing to remember here is that a safe call which isn't made needs to be reported
<fire^runner> abi if an officer walks in and sees another being flogged or tied and bound..there is evidence
<`abi> better for someone to have to explain that they are fine than for someone not to be around to explain that they aren't
* |Karen agrees with abi again
* canplay nods to abi
<arhiannah{R}> right...losing track of time isn't an excuse for a safecall being missed....
<BernieRoehl> My understanding is that there needs to be some form of complaint from the submissive (...but note that I am not a lawyer...)
<LrdTZ> Please make you safecalls.
<BernieRoehl> We're just about out of time...
<BernieRoehl> So the procedure we've talked about goes like this.... beforehand, make sure the safecall person knows the location of the meeting and the phone number (ideally, cell phone). Arrange for two safecalls, at pre-determined times, with a code phrase to let the person know all is well.
<BernieRoehl> If the calls aren't received, the safecall person should call the number. If there's no answer, or no code phrase forthcoming, call the police and say your friend had a date with someone she met on the internet, and didn't call when they were supposed to, and you think she might be in danger. Don't mention BDSM.
* Kilted_One frowns....is all this play going on on the the first meeting??? or have we moved on in the relationship and we are debating the merits of continuing safecalls (was unavoidable detained)...apologies if I have missed something along the way
<BernieRoehl> We've actually moved on to what to do when a safecall is missed
<BernieRoehl> Does that summarize what we've come up with?
* `abi smiles at KO...but vixen can check in with me anytime you and she are playing KO ;)
<Kilted_One> on the first meeting though is my ??
<|Karen> we seem to be assuming that everyone plays on the first date, KO....typical
* Kilted_One nods to Karen....my point exactly
<|Karen> and I wonder why no one wants to get to know each other as human beings first....
<|Karen> geez.
<canplay> i was not assuming that, i use safe call on first date and first scene , not the same thing
<BernieRoehl> I don't think everyone plays on the first "date", necessarily, but I think much of this applies regardless of first/second/final? dates
<Kilted_One> somewhere along the line did we forget to say...:Don't play on your first meeting"
<canplay> thanks for saying it KO *smiles*
<|Karen> and "Meet in a public place"
* BernieRoehl nods
<|Karen> and "use your brain"
<BernieRoehl> Well, it's 10 pm. Anyone have any other closing thoughts?
<crysania^> maybe another discussion topic, first meetings
<Kilted_One> sorry folks if I'm a little confused, however it is an important point that I would like made
<BernieRoehl> Good suggestion, crysania
<`abi> and I'm not here to judge anyone's morals...people need safecalls regardless of which "date" they start to play on
* canplay thinks crysania just volunteered to host :)
<BernieRoehl> Okay, let's wrap it up there. By all means, continue chatting informally. However, I'll close the log here.
* crysania^ nope, nope, nope, shakes head
<BernieRoehl> Thanks to everyone for participating!
<fire^runner> welcome Bernie you can pay us later
<crysania^> Thank You for moderating
<kathryn_kw> :)
<canplay> thanks Bernie, great job once again :)
* `DebUTaunt arrives fashionably late
<BernieRoehl> My pleasure!
<|Karen> thank you Bernie
<BernieRoehl> Thanks!
<fire^runner> ~wink~
<dalian> thanks Bernie
<|Karen> hi Deb :)
<crysania^> Greetings `DebUTaunt
<BernieRoehl> Next week's topic will be "The Mainstreaming of BDSM", and it will be moderated by the lovely abi