May 19 2002 EhBC Online Discussion

May 19, 2002 EhBC Online Discussion

#bdsm-kw url is http://home.golden.net/~ehbc
<justagrrl> a result of the long weekend maybe?
<BernieRoehl> Hi, everyone!
<xxendlessdesirexx> finally rouble has come..
<BernieRoehl> Had trouble getting a server
<xxendlessdesirexx> *trouble*
<xxendlessdesirexx> lol
* BernieRoehl smiles at xxendlessdesirexx
* BernieRoehl looks around at the small turnout
<xxendlessdesirexx> :P
<SkyDom> pebbly......are you the pebs that I've known forever??
<justagrrl> hi Bernie
<BernieRoehl> Hi, justagrrl
<mist{LW}> howdie there MasterGuny :}
<mist{LW}> just romp down Wellington and we might just spot ya xxendlessdesirexx
<pebbly`> lol sure am SkyDom....was wondering when you would remember!
<xxendlessdesirexx> lol that is good to know mist he he
<yummy> hello BernieRoehl
<SkyDom> Well, hugs, hon!!!!! How are ya??
<yummy> hi {OT}cariye
<{OT}cariye> hello everyone :)
<pebbly`> *Hugs* really good...and you?
<justagrrl> hello SkyDom
<xxendlessdesirexx> how was the brunch Bernie?
* BernieRoehl thinks we should wait a couple of minutes and see if we get a few more people
<MasterGuny> Hi there mist{LW} :-)
<SkyDom> Hi, justagrrl
<BernieRoehl> It was good, xxendlessdesirexx! We had 20 people, lots of good conversations
<xxendlessdesirexx> oh bummer...
<BernieRoehl> More people at the munch than at the discussion tonight :-)
<xxendlessdesirexx> well i am glad you all had a good time
<SkyDom> The hockey crowd should be showing up in a minute, Bernie
<xxendlessdesirexx> what did you do to them Bernie?...
<lil`tigress{TJ}> how many at the munch ???
<BernieRoehl> Who won, SkyDom?
<lil`tigress{TJ}> yes they lost dang it
<xxendlessdesirexx> scared them away?
<mist{LW}> hiya Bernie
<BernieRoehl> 20, lil`tigress{TJ}
<lil`tigress{TJ}> ahh .. so a good crowd then
<SkyDom> We lost
* BernieRoehl smiles as people start showing up
<SkyDom> OT
<MasterGuny> Hi pebbly`
<BernieRoehl> Yeah, I was surprised -- middle of a long weekend, and all
* {OT}cariye blinks
<xxendlessdesirexx> hello A/all i missed
<mist{LW}> hiya Master
* BernieRoehl figures another minute or so and we'll get started
<xxendlessdesirexx> well let's see my options... stay in my bedroom and chat here,... or leave my room and risk being tackled by that damn bog spider on my door... *shiver* (go away! shooo)
<MrScotdom> Connection rate is terrible... hi all
<mist{LW}> wb Master
<{OT}cariye> bog spider ? what is that
<BernieRoehl> Yeah, took me a while to get a server
<LORDWOLF> ty hate this nextgen
<xxendlessdesirexx> ummm.... slave name for big,...when there is a ball gag in mouth?
<xxendlessdesirexx> lol
<BernieRoehl> Found a good one, though -- nice fast ping times
<SkyDom> xx....did I tell ya that I run a little spider killing company?
<{OT}cariye> lol ok ...
<MrScotdom> I guess I should have paid for my Internet access
<xxendlessdesirexx> i hate those buggers.... i really do...
<Sir_StephenS> lol
<BernieRoehl> Me too -- always hated spiders
<MrScotdom> aracnaphobia
* mist{LW} also hates spiders
<BernieRoehl> Anyway, now that people are showing up, we should get started
<mist{LW}> especially the big ones :p
<xxendlessdesirexx> too many legs... only thing that should have that many things is a flogger if you ask me...
<mist{LW}> lol
<xxendlessdesirexx> :)
<BernieRoehl> I've set an automatic channel message that reads as follows....
<BernieRoehl> Welcome to or regular Sunday night discussion. Please refrain from sending "hi" and "bye" messages until after 10 pm. Also note that the discussion is being logged. If you wish to remain anonymous, you should change your nick. We recommend using twisted.ma.us.dal.net as your server, to minimize lag. Tonight's discussion is "Playpartners, submissives and slaves -- how are they different?". The moderator is BernieRoehl. Enjoy the discussion!
<BernieRoehl> This topic was first discussed last year, but it's a good one that keeps coming up
<SkyDom> Does this mean we can't chat any nore?
<SkyDom> more
<xxendlessdesirexx> *chuckles*
<BernieRoehl> I was at a seminar that Jack McGeorge gave in Toronto last weekend (it was excellent, by the way) and this was one of the topics that came up
<BernieRoehl> So, anyone have any opening thoughts, or starting points for some definitions?
<xxendlessdesirexx> some people view being a sub, a beginner to medium level of the lifestyle, where becoming a slave is the ultimate goal..
<SkyDom> I'm really pissed that the Leafs lost
<xxendlessdesirexx> (someone had to say something..lol)
<SkyDom> Ooooops.....sorry
<MrScotdom> Playpartner - occasional trip into BDSM and a learned few hours about each other. Submissive - More adept and focussed realisation of her/his desires focus. Slave - experienced learned individual knowing what he/she requires/desires in life within the realms of BDSM
<Masterguny-> When I went public years ago the difference we used was that a collared submissive became a slave to her Master
<mist{LW}> and playpartner seems to be more casual, or not so deep
<rhiannon{KO}> i would say it's all a mind set...
<yummy> xxendlessdesirexx, i don't kow why one has to be considered higher or "ultimate" - they are different
<jewel`{F}> every one has their own feelings about each and each can mean something different to different people
<xxendlessdesirexx> yes i agree yummy, it was just someones opinion i argued with today
<rhiannon{KO}> so very true jewel`{F}..
* #bdsm-kw is being logged
<xxendlessdesirexx> some people think a slave has no rights, what do other's think?...
<MrScotdom> Without the mind control aspect... I personally fail to see a true connection between the respective parties
<xxendlessdesirexx> i think the save becomes a slave accepting the set rules made by M and s..
<Masterguny-> in my case it is spelled out in the contract
<BernieRoehl> I think that the idea of it being some kind of "progession" or "hierarchy" is a bit dated. I get the sense that most people these days view them as separate types of relationships, rather than one being "better" or more desireable than the other
<xxendlessdesirexx> (i can't spell)
<Sir_StephenS> thats good BernieRoehl...puts less pressure on people
<MrScotdom> I would not express the terminology of "better"... rather more experienced.
<{OT}cariye> when I started coming here a couple years ago there were bottoms and subs ..very few who called themselves slave
* BernieRoehl agrees with Sir_StephenS
<yummy> there are people who i enjoy playing with who i have no desire to submit to in any other way than play
<jewel`{F}> again each realationship is different and what one couple calls a slave another couple may just feel it is only submissive
<mist{LW}> i think that being submissive gives a lot more choice to the bottom, than slave does, and in a true Master/slave relationship the slave gives up control of her life to her Master
<Masterguny-> It is like most other terms we use depending on when you came into the lifestyle and who you associated with words have different interpitations
<MrScotdom> Play submission/domination to Me is a sort of part time excursion.... kinda like playing darts.
<mist{LW}> i am slave to my Master, but not as deep as some others i know lol
<mist{LW}> i tell Him no still
* jewel`{F} winks at mist{LW}
<mist{LW}> but then i tell Him why i am saying it, and if He still wishes it, then i will do it, not always happily tho lol
* rhiannon{KO} wishes..lol..
<MrScotdom> In every facet of life we have the good bad and indifferent
<Jean__Luc> hello
<Masterguny-> But mist{LW} you still consider yourself a slave to him
<mist{LW}> i am more slave than submissive, yes
<Masterguny-> What were you before accepting his collar?
<mist{LW}> but then our relationship is still growing
<mist{LW}> slave lol
<Masterguny-> It always grows
<mist{LW}> for most of my BDSM i have thought i was slave rather than submissive
<MrScotdom> slave versus submissive is a criteria best understood between the two individuals involved. There is no definitive right way or wrong way when acceptable by both parites.
<Masterguny-> so with or without a Master you considered yourself a slave not a submissive?
<lil`tigress{TJ}> any couples relationship .. grows as time goes on.. and their feelings grow along with what they learn and experience about each other..
<mist{LW}> yes, i do
<mist{LW}> but until collared there isnt the total control given to just anyone
<BernieRoehl> That's a good point -- are people defined by their relationships, or is their self-definition independent of anyone else?
<Sir_StephenS> there should be some kind of difference between slave and submissive that we can agree on and put into words...otherwise they are only secret code terms between couples
<Masterguny-> were did you get the definition from or why did you not feel that you were a submissive?
<Sir_StephenS> rather within couples
<mist{LW}> because what i was searching for was to be able to give up that control to a Master
<MrScotdom> Equality is a process of familiarity
<yummy> but if you aren't part of the couple does it really matter what titles they use
<lil`tigress{TJ}> Masterguny- .. i do believe .. that whether a girl is or thinks she is slave .. or submissive.. feels their own special submission deep inside.. if not they would not be who them are..
<MrScotdom> One can be submissive... but have no tangible source to deliver it to... then what... do you suddenly become vanilla? No.. needs and desires = opportunity.
<Masterguny-> that was not the question I was asking we learn our definitions somewhere read online told but we get that information and apply it to our selves
<LORDWOLF> submissive acceptable to one will or surrender of some freewill -------- slave gives upmost to all control
<mist{LW}> i dont believe i could ever be vanilla again
<jewel`{F}> someone that may to most not seem very submissive at all could actually become slave to One
<yummy> MrScotdom, i think one accepts who they are and doesn't worry about the titles others give it
<MrScotdom> slaves were once submissives... who were once novices... once vanilla
<mist{LW}> i think i would search out another relationship within the BDSM realm
<lil`tigress{TJ}> MrScotdom .. what makes you think that a person who is submissive in their souls would suddenly go back to vanilla life.. without a Dom/me Master/Mistress.. it is not being with an owner that makes us who we are
<xxendlessdesirexx> vanilla= just 1 flavor, not evil enough
<SkyDom> I knew there was a reason I love Baskin Robbins
<mist{LW}> i agree lil`tigress{TJ}
<MrScotdom> lil tigress... my suggestion was asked with a questionmark?
<{OT}cariye> I think aperson could be all three depending on the Partner at the time
<lil`tigress{TJ}> oh i know MrScotdom .. and my remarks were made from me.. from inside me...
<MrScotdom> eh?
<Masterguny-> so you are saying a submissive can still be a submissive after being collared?
<jewel`{F}> MrScotdom i have been submissive all my life it is not just the lifestyle or community that makes me submissive but it gives me a place to be the best of what i can be for One
* yummy looks are folks telling me i'm not submissive because i don't have a Dom?
<xxendlessdesirexx> grrr
<MrScotdom> Most of us have been this way all our lives... something made us realsise that we were not abnormal... and here we are.
<LORDWOLF> yes they can be sub
<{OT}cariye> I consider myself slave but only submitted to my ex hubby as a poor sub
<LORDWOLF> even if they have a dom
* jewel`{F} agress with {OT}cariye
<{OT}cariye> SO... maybe it is the level of Master that helps to determine the level of submitting?
<Masterguny-> no when I started out it was a submisive became a slave to her Master once she was collared the only change was ownership not what the person was inside
<MrScotdom> The advent of the Internet has procreated many a relationship and understanding of who we really are within this lifestyle
<xxendlessdesirexx> Ooo i hate those who take in slaves for there posessions (money ect..) greedy little buggers
<mist{LW}> i think the definition of submissive vs slave has changed tho, even from when i first set foot in here
<MrScotdom> I believe it is in the mind
<LORDWOLF> it depends on the couple in how they and they alone define the relantionship
<MrScotdom> I agree LORDWOLF
<MrScotdom> No right or wrong... just a learned evolution
* Jean__Luc thinks definitions are best left to distionary folk.. and, well, usually end up in big huge discussions that.. well, usually don't really achieve much, other than arguments.. sorry..
<xxendlessdesirexx> it does all depend on what is agreed, but you better be sure to see what's there...
<MrScotdom> Once you have arrived in the mainstream... it is pretty much splitting hairs after that.
<Sir_StephenS> so there is no value in using the term slave vs sub, other than in talking with your partner?
<MrScotdom> I believe a slave is more atuned more of the time.. to what she wants to give and how she is received by her partner.
<mist{LW}> i think that to some calling them slave would be an insult which they would not like
<Jean__Luc> well.. to my though... a partner is a partner.. and, the term slave or sub, means different things to each and everyone, so, I can/will interchange them, because, my perception of these two words, and my partners are the only two that count..specially since the 'scene' cannot seem to come up with specific definitions for the terms
<LORDWOLF> lol Jean__Luc that is the purpose of this room and why we discuss is to help others example like my self who does not say too much most time to speak my mind once in awhile freely with someone put me the fuck down for not being able to speak or spell clearly thankyou
<mist{LW}> while to myself or others it is a compliment, because someone has recognised how deep we have given up that control
<MrScotdom> hahahaha Lordwolf... yes Sir... I know exactly what you mean SIr..... fortunately these folks are good souls
<Jean__Luc> oh..I understand LORDWOLF.. no offence meant.. just saying how I feel about tonights' topic..
<LORDWOLF> as was i
<Jean__Luc> ok.. cool :)
<LORDWOLF> it is all in the degree of control [mist{LW}:#bdsm-kw PING]
<MrScotdom> How does submission relate to equality whether you "play" with someone or whether they are regarded as a submissive or slave?
<MrScotdom> I dont think it matters... one is more permanent than the other
<MrScotdom> When you look at someone at a munch or playparty... how can you tell if they are submissive, play partne or slave anyway?????
<Jean__Luc> well..I am off.. if only survivor can finish..argh.. later folks.. be well.. ":)
<yummy> MrScotdom - asking works..
<mist{LW}> grrrrrrrrrr
<LORDWOLF> bye how brattty they reply to others
<MrScotdom> hahahaha
<mist{LW}> hmm, does that make me a playpartner lol
<LORDWOLF> my slave is only bratty to me most times
<MrScotdom> I thought that was determined by the time of the month hahahah
<mist{LW}> lol
<xxendlessdesirexx> lol
<LORDWOLF> very true
* mist{LW} swats LORDWOLF
<jewel`{F}> perhaps by watching them and their interactions with others and their partner
<MrScotdom> Just kidding... put that flogger down
<CaRoLe{George}> has any sub/slave/playpartner here found that their own definition of who they are changes with the person they are submitting to?
<MrScotdom> I think our BDSM conunterparts are best recognised by closer observation
<LORDWOLF> she going to get spanking later
<Masterguny-> the best way is to ask
<yummy> as I play only with those who i have gotten to know, whether a stranger knows if i am sub/slave/whatever is immaterial, now if they want to get to know me that is soemthing else altogether
<Masterguny-> even a Domme will occasionally submit :-)
* mist{LW} smiles at the thought of later
<xxendlessdesirexx> (random thought: i think it is funny that some adult buy a matching "Master" collar for the slave collar....)
<CaRoLe{George}> yes, Masterguny, and sometimes Doms do too... <sweet smile>
<xxendlessdesirexx> *adult stores*
<MrScotdom> Carole. I do not think the persons definition changes.. maybe style and particular flavour of the Dominant... but I do not feel there are any earth shattering changes to the soul with different partners
<Masterguny-> that is a recent trend same as the () you see after a Dominant name
<CaRoLe{George}> I disagree MrScotdom... I think the level of control that the Dominant gives me would dictate how I would respond to Him.
<rhiannon{KO}> imo it takes a "Top" to bring out a bottom, a "Dom" to bring out a submissive, and a "Master" to make a slave...
<LORDWOLF> the bitch just bite me
<MrScotdom> Yes... but no earth shattering differences in beliefs of whom you are
* CaRoLe{George} applauds rhiannon
* {OT}cariye agrees with rhiannon{KO}
<mist{LW}> yes CaRoLe{George}, i agree also
<lil`tigress{TJ}> i do not know about anyone else but for me.. equality is in the heart.. the love and feelings someone gives another.. and what is felt in return..
<lil`tigress{TJ}> and in so many ways .. that is true rhiannon{KO}
<CaRoLe{George}> maybe it would give an epiphany to one who was searching, to find the One who could bring out that level of submission
<jewel`{F}> very well said rhiannon{KO}
<BernieRoehl> So out of curiousity... how many people here would identify themselves as "slave" and how many as "submissive"?
<BernieRoehl> (in or out of a relationship)
<mist{LW}> slave
* {OT}cariye is slave
<MrScotdom> The very particulate of multiple partners over a non descript period of time... will favour a persons experience in delivery of D or s.
* rhiannon{KO} is slave...
* CaRoLe{George} shrugs.... I'm a SwItCh.... :)
<mist{LW}> how about Dom/Master?
<lil`tigress{TJ}> slave
<BernieRoehl> Good point, mist{LW} -- who here identifies as Dom or Master?
<jewel`{F}> i feel i am both i am a submissive person but slave to One
<LORDWOLF> i know who i am /lwho
<Masterguny-> I am a Dominant and a Master
<MrScotdom> I was only a slave to my mother.... then I took revenge.... hahaha
<rhiannon{KO}> i do not work, i have no income, i stay home and take care of Master's home and Him. i own nothing in this house, i entered naked, and will leave naked (hopefully that time will never come) i wear Master's kolar 24/7...
* LORDWOLF is male, 48, r/t Master to mist{LW}, living in London, Ont
<{OT}cariye> Master says I am His slave and equal to all others
<mist{LW}> yes, that would be me jewell{T}, i like that, submissive to most, slave to one
<rhiannon{KO}> so i say i am a slave.
<MrScotdom> I think you are wonderful rhiannon... naked or not hehehehe
<mist{LW}> have always been submissive, even as child
<Sir_StephenS> Top here
<rhiannon{KO}> thanks MrScotdom.
<MrScotdom> Definately Demonstrivately Dominant
<LdyAkilah> i would hope you did not leave naked rhiannon{KO}...there are more responsibilities of the master than to have you leave naked
<Masterguny-> Demon? yup that fits Scotty
<MrScotdom> (eyebrows jumping up and down like frenzied caterpillars rhiannon)
<Masterguny-> :-)
<MrScotdom> hahaha
<rhiannon{KO}> i haven't left, i am still here..;)
<jewel`{F}> i think that my Master is most deffinately a Dominant Man but He is Master only to me
<rhiannon{KO}> but if i ever was released, then i would leave with nothing.
* CaRoLe{George} shudders
<rhiannon{KO}> well put jewell{T}....
<LdyAkilah> even the laws do not allow that rhiannon{KO}
<{OT}cariye> laws do not allow ownership of another either
<mist{LW}> is not part of the Masters task to ensure that should a slave leave she will be able to be provided for??
<rhiannon{KO}> and the law doesn't allow "slavery", yet we call ourselves slaves??
<LORDWOLF> i am the man your mom warn you about
<LdyAkilah> exactly...so there is some element of reality to be entered here
<LdyAkilah> perhaps it's time to review the term slave
<mist{LW}> ahh, but my Master didnt purchase me, so legally i am not slave, however, in mine and Masters eyes i am
<rhiannon{KO}> yes mist, Master would take care of me...after i left until i could support myself.
<MrScotdom> KO is a fine and fair Master... he would at least leave you with the TV remote
<LdyAkilah> and rename it to something more appropriate for this lifestlye
<CaRoLe{George}> whoa, MOST men wouldn't do that MrScotdom
<MrScotdom> hahahaha
<MrScotdom> hey.... I didnt say there would be batteries in it hahha
* mist{LW} cant even get near the remote when Master is on the couch, He growls
<LORDWOLF> lol
<Masterguny-> I like him :-)
<{OT}cariye> my remote works ..the TV does not
<Masterguny-> Well I have remotes that do other things than work the TV center :-)
<BernieRoehl> We've been talking a lot so far about slaves, and to some extent submissives
<rhiannon{KO}> Master is an excellent Master, and very fair, but i entered as a slave, (what W/we call slave) i knew what He would do for me, during our relationship and even after (if that would ever happen) i trust Him, i know i would be taken care of.
<BernieRoehl> What about less intense relationships -- playpartners?
<CaRoLe{George}> LdyAkilah, I think the whole idea is to take the stigma away from the term "slave", like we're trying to take the stigma away from the term "slut" ...
<MrScotdom> Hockey Night in Canada... 6 minute commercials... just enough time to go to the fridge, have a pee.. and swat your subbie a few times beofre the game comes back on.
<LdyAkilah> lol, good luck!
* mist{LW} gasps, there is a stigma about being slutty?????
<LORDWOLF> ben lokking for of button on slave for long time gee no directions will have twist this pull that
<mist{LW}> :p
<CaRoLe{George}> I guess that the majority of the time I would be considered a playpartner... though sometimes I'm considered a Domme... and sometimes I consider myself a submissive.
* {OT}cariye is reading a book about whores in history
<SkyDom> Not that I'm aware of, mist
<mist{LW}> no off button Master lol
<MistressSarcastica> Less intense, Bernie? Why would you say that?
* mist{LW} just keeps on bratting
<mist{LW}> <---------energizer subbie
<LdyAkilah> the term slave has too negative a conotation, and it is still to prevelant in the minds of many from the US and around the world
<jewel`{F}> my understanding of a playpartner works for both sides of the scale, Dominant and submissive, they are those that enjoy the play aspect of the BDSM lifestyle but do not want the rest of the commitment
<mist{LW}> yup, i think want the fun, but not the work that comes with taking on/submitting to someone in particular
<LdyAkilah> what the word has become is not in any way reflective of how we enjoy the lifestyle
<BernieRoehl> My sense is that the term "playpartner" seems less emotionally intense than "slave", but of course others might feel differently
<LORDWOLF> yes some have im me in the past suggesting i was not a good dom because i give you more freedom then some do
<jewel`{F}> that is not to say that one that plays with out a relationship does not want that, just that they have not found it yet
<MrScotdom> The terminology "slave" to me is a more respected and literary example of experience within the realms of BDSM.
* lil`tigress{TJ} shakes her head.. for me.. when i top .. it is just that .. i am not dominant . except when at work or dealing with my kids.. for me .. i am submissive in my soul.. i am a slave.. and when being topped in a scene by someone other than my Master.. it is just that playing.. relieving stress in some ways and enjoying having my ass beaten in others
<LORDWOLF> to them i say too bad it works for us
<mist{LW}> perhaps You shouldnt have told me i wasnt a puppy to roll over when commanded lol
<CaRoLe{George}> well, you definitely notice that many submissives put more value on the title "slave" than they do "submissive" ... it's like a badge of honour
<MrScotdom> Novices for example do not become "slaves" overnight.
<LORDWOLF> roll over bitch
<mist{LW}> lol
<LdyAkilah> it's been recognized that there are very few who are really 'slaves' in bdsm
<CaRoLe{George}> no, and I would humbly suggest that novice Dominants shouldn't title themselves "Master" before they pick up a flogger for the first time either.
<MrScotdom> lil tigress... that was a good example
<LdyAkilah> why not MrScotdom? if it is in your heart, that is what you are
<Masterguny-> in my terms they can if collared by a Master that person becomes his slave notice or not
<Masterguny-> novice
<MrScotdom> Carole... hahahah... yes thats why I use te annotation MR Scotdom.
* CaRoLe{George} grins
<mist{LW}> how can they become slave when they dont even know what it means to submit that deep Masterguny-
<LORDWOLF> i agee but honestly where does it say being a dom has to be all or if any physical
<CaRoLe{George}> didn't there used to be a very strict and ritualized series of tests that Dominants had to go through before they could call themselves Master? or is that really REALLY "Old School?"
<Masterguny-> they are talk by their Master and explore that world together
<yummy> does it matter what you or I think about whether someone is a sub or slave to another......it is there relationship not yours or mine
<MrScotdom> In reality.. regardless of names protocol and title... in meeting a person and enjoying them as a friend... that is ultimately where the friendship/appreciation first manifests itself...
<Masterguny-> taught
<rhiannon{KO}> if its old school CaRoLe{George}, i think alot of people would benifit if it was brought back..lol
<CaRoLe{George}> I agree, but where the heck would you set up a school? lol
<Masterguny-> spell checker no help me LOL
<MistressSarcastica> Old Guard.
<mist{LW}> i think so also rhiannon{KO}, would be nice to see more Doms looking for mentorship
<lil`tigress{TJ}> for each couple it is what they want .. that makes their own relationship what it is in their own eyes.. as for anyone else... whose business is it really if a girl considers herself more slave than submissive.. for even as a slave you do have and feel your submission
<LORDWOLF> my grandfather was not phsyical only about 100 lbs and small but when he spoke the mountains rumbled
<rhiannon{KO}> lol...true.
<yummy> no CaRoLe{George}, the real question is whose version of old Guard would prevail
<MrScotdom> Old School has unfortunately been smothered by the blanket of popularity... not experience
<mist{LW}> it is a fad, and it will die out, leaving those of us who live it as a serious lifestyle
<Masterguny-> very true MrScotdom
<mist{LW}> i think we are the ones who shape what it is to our communities
<rhiannon{KO}> i sometimes cringe when i see someone with the title of "Master" online, because of the newbies out there, they tend to think that because a person has that title in their nick they should be knewledgable, and sometimes they are "NOT"
<CaRoLe{George}> most of them are NOT.
<Masterguny-> not true mist...It has grown over the years and continues to grow
<LdyAkilah> yes unfortunately the floodgates have been opened
<lil`tigress{TJ}> so very true rhiannon{KO} ... to be called Master as a nick.. shows. .for so many what and where they are coming from.. not from experience for the most part
<CaRoLe{George}> well, BDSM is all main-stream now.... lol.... little 15 year olds are wearing collars... god help us.
<mist{LW}> i ment the fad part of it tho Masterguny-, the ones who wear the cuffs because they are cool, not because a Master put them there
<LORDWOLF> i have had a domit personally and in early yes i could hurt one very badly but only if proke
<jewel`{F}> just because the word Master is part of a nic does not make them a Master, i rarely use the master as part of a nic as i call only One Master
<Masterguny-> I believe the public is gowing at a more rapid rate these days than the private
<MrScotdom> The Internet, online groups has led to the increased availability of fellow BDSMers.. but has led to the demise of the closed shop Old Scholl of the 70's and 80's
<rhiannon{KO}> very true jewell{T}, i all only One Master, i respect only "One" and will give others consideration...
<rhiannon{KO}> all=call
<Sir_StephenS> I think the popularity of bdsm is ok..there is no need to keep it hidden away...what is strong will not be damaged by the light
<jewel`{F}> the fact that the kids are wearing the collars and cuffs just makes it easier for us to wear ours out in public
<BernieRoehl> Good point, Sir_StephenS
<CaRoLe{George}> it doesn't hurt to have the info out there, but as they say, a LITTLE knowledge is a dangerous thing... just because a dominant has read the CastleRealm doesn't make him/her a safe player
<LdyAkilah> yes and also to the structure
<mist{LW}> thats true jewell{T}, hadnt thought of that before lol
<Masterguny-> when I started online Most doms were MasterXXXXX I have used this nick for over 14 years today you will notice most don't
<LORDWOLF> if i told you to do something you better be doing it was the way i was t9ill i had my stroke but maybe to be a dom or master one must of compassion to and remember above all else our subs or slaves are yes human beings too
<MrScotdom> Structure begins with our recognition of who we are
<Sir_StephenS> yes jewell{T}, that is a corollary point
<LdyAkilah> that should already been known when entering the lifestyle
<MrScotdom> The internet... such as this IRC list.. is the results of technological advances... not an increase in the popularity of BDSM
<jewel`{F}> i will also not use mistress as part of a nic again because the term Master or Mistress should only be used by those that person has collared
<MrScotdom> "should" jewel??????
* BernieRoehl notes that there are only a couple of minutes left in the formal part of the discussion
<Masterguny-> so you would change your nick for that reason?
<jewel`{F}> MrScotdom meaning that those that are not collared should not use the term
<mist{LW}> think that its a personal choice to call someone Master, Mistress, myself, i would not call any but LordWolf Master as He owns me
<MrScotdom> My nick is Mr ..... non confrontational and non presumptious.
<mist{LW}> i use the nick to talk with You Masterguny-, but i wont accord You the title of Master since You are not mine :}
<jewel`{F}> i still offer my respect to them and will use the Sir and the Ma'am until or unless Master or i feel that respect is not earned
<LORDWOLF> i have hopely earn the referance of Master by my slave and sir by others subs or slaves
<mist{LW}> i tend to put Sir after it, or Ma'am
<BernieRoehl> Well, it's 10 pm and the discussion is still going strong :-)
<Masterguny-> if you have ever seen any one call me Master I quickly corrent them I am Not there Master I am MG Guny etc..but I will not change who I am because times have changed LOL
<BernieRoehl> I'm going to close the log, but please feel free to continue chatting informally
<MrScotdom> MasterGuny is a fine person... and after meeting Him... would have no recourse in referring to Him as Master. Proof that one has to meet the names behind the nicks.
<BernieRoehl> Thanks to everyone who participated!
<MrScotdom> Thanks Bernie
<rhiannon{KO}> great discussion Bernie..;)
<mist{LW}> a good topic Bernie