March 4 2001 EhBC Online Discussion

<BernieRoehl> Well, it's 9 pm
<BernieRoehl> Time for the discussion to start
<BernieRoehl> Tonight is "newbie night" -- a chance for newbies (and not-so-newbies) to ask questions and hopefully get a few answers
<BernieRoehl> We hope to do these once a month or so, for the benefit of anyone who's new to the scene
<aliceinchains> the most important lesson i hold dear is the one of patience,,if that is adhered to things just flow naturally
<DarkAngel^{nym}> I think they are a great idea BernieRoehl
<Skinger> Bernie Roehl, I am totally new, green etc so that would be great
<BernieRoehl> Thanks, DA!
<Skinger> bernie how did you get into this
<BernieRoehl> That's good advice, aliceinchains -- patience is important, especially when someone is just starting out
<janiz> but alice..what do you do..when there is a fuck up in the scene
<BernieRoehl> Started when I was pretty young, Skinger -- 17 or so, with my first girlfriend
<dalian> would one advise someone new to the scene...to play as often as possible before seeking a permanent D/s partner?
<BernieRoehl> She asked me to spank her, and I found I *really* enjoyed it
<candie```> hi arhiannah :)
<BernieRoehl> Good question, dalian
<aliceinchains> again,,the patience prevails,,if a scence goes bad,,retrospection calmly seeing if perchance there was something not touched upon during negotiations
* MsTiia For those of you who don't knoe me, please be advised that I really "do" remember my first experience and my first "coming out" and even "I" was then reluctant to speak ..... so ..... relax
<aliceinchains> and also,,,take away a lesson from that experience
<Skinger> The only reason that i have been thinking about this scene is that my current girlfriend loves being sucked on hard and biten and it turns me on
<DarkAngel^{nym}> hard to say dalian ,,,, many discover BDSM while exploring with spouses ect
<Lancaster{d}> dalian I personally have tried spanking and bdsm s3everal times with people i did not love ,, did not enjoy it one bit ,, will never do it again
<BernieRoehl> That's a good way to start, Skinger
<fr0ggy> if I may ask my question now
<BernieRoehl> Sure, fr0ggy
<DarkAngel^{nym}> certainly fr0ggy
<fr0ggy> with S&M play..
<fr0ggy> there is talk of being warmed up
<Skinger> I thought I was a freak and that I should join a Vampire club... (sorry for being so harsh)
<fr0ggy> so that the pain is not felt as pain but rather pleasures...
<fr0ggy> how does one get to this state..
<dalian> i have come to enjoy most of the experiences...but have to admit...that it also is missing something and i've been left feeling very empty
<DarkAngel^{nym}> sensation play fr0ggy ,,, and getting to that state ,, if it is even posible for a person ,,, is different for most
<MsTiia> ..... "warmed up" froggy? this is emotionally or physically?
<fr0ggy> emotionally MsTiia
<DarkAngel^{nym}> I think what you refer to fr0ggy ,, is when the endorphins hit the sub
<MsTiia> WEll, then it boils down to trust and desire to play first
<KO_n_rhiannon> <technical explaination> froggy pain is pain...endorphins are released by the brain to help cope or partially numb the pain...but pain is pain....enough endorphins and you get "sub space"......t odo this a slow and mythodical increase in the pain level is used
<janiz> for me..its the ... mind set froggy...first....then....as i go on my journey..and feel the ..heat of the..toys...
<aliceinchains> for each it is different,,my own experience is ,,touch,,talk,,carresses,,but that level of trust has to be there
* fr0ggy hugs cassi helo
<fr0ggy> so in other words...
<fr0ggy> keep an open mind..
<fr0ggy> and just take my time
<fr0ggy> and if i dont like an experience
<fr0ggy> sit down
<fr0ggy> and figure out why?
<janiz> different Tops..do it play different....COMMUNICATION...is the key
<BernieRoehl> That's a good way to approach it, fr0ggy
<MsTiia> You would not get into an experience until you had trust ..... right?
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> patience is important or it was to me i kept wanting more
<BernieRoehl> And to answer an earlier question, I think it's a good idea for someone to experience a lot of things before choosing a "serious" D/s partner
* aliceinchains agrees with autumn`breeze{JFC},,patience is what keeps me inquisitive also
<fr0ggy> *shrugs* okay
* dalian smiles and nods to Bernie
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> exactly aliceinchains but tell my brain that
<aliceinchains> again i can oly speak from personal experiences,,watching others at play parties,,and reading accellerates my growth and hunger for mor,,it works and is well worth the waiting
<DarkAngel^{nym}> curiosity is what brought us all down this road
<victoria_angel{Flint}> patience and trust are certainly key, but this level of excitement you seek fr0ggy might come from the need to not PLAN out the scene, but the excitement of the unknown (based on agreed upon limits), a craving
<KO_n_rhiannon> naaa DA..SEX did
<SkyDom> Amen, victoria!
<Skinger> aliceinchains, please tell me something, what is this thing that is worth waiting for???
<DarkAngel^{nym}> all sorts of curiosities KO_n_rhiannon ,,,lol,, and then hunger set in
<aliceinchains> for me,,,it is that mindset of totally giving of myself to my One,,the electricity that flows with the slightest touch,,
<Northerner^> any suggestions as to changing the dynamics in an already established vanilla relationship to more of a D/s one?
<Skinger> so it is like a build up of energy and it builds up and up
<aliceinchains> and also,,being able to see myself with unclouded vision,,and simply enjoy
* KO_n_rhiannon thinks that Ray is the Rayovac man wiv all dat charge
<aliceinchains> gee Northerner^ another good one for me,,that was my situation as most of you know,,
<aliceinchains> lol@ KO
<Lancaster{d}> Northener both to read a book
<BernieRoehl> I know a lot of people who have made that transition -- some more successfully than others
<BernieRoehl> Yes, giving your partner things to read is a good start
<BernieRoehl> Particularly things that resonate with you personally
<arhiannah> leave the reading by the toilet...tucked inside the reader's digest ;)
<BernieRoehl> A lot depends on the nature of the vanilla relationship, and how good the communication is
<Northerner^> we are past that point, here together actually
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> to relax and trust
<aliceinchains> i had interst in the lifestyle first,,a hunger,,,W/we have always had excellent communication,,gradually i brought some play into our activities then opened the door for discussion,,the rest is magic,,again,,that is just my own experience,,but as any toher honesty is paramount
<BernieRoehl> If you are a couple that communicates well already, then it will be a *lot* easier than if there are communications issues
<victoria_angel{Flint}> Northerner, both persons need to be willing, like trying to use ties of silk before leather and rope....
<victoria_angel{Flint}> a smack with hand, before flogger, get it?
<Skinger> may I ask a question?
<BernieRoehl> The next step will be to talk. And talk and talk and talk. Try to find out where your interests overlap.
<BernieRoehl> Go ahead, Skinger
<DarkAngel^{nym}> certainly Skinger
<Northerner^> ......gradual...yes
* aliceinchains nods her head at Bernie in agreement
<Skinger> Is BDSM about giving pain, receiving pain or sex?
* KO_n_rhiannon would suggest that both of them search the internet and find things that "turn them on and off" and then take the tamer things and try them r/l to see if the thought of em or the act of doing them is the same for both of them
* KO_n_rhiannon would suggest that both of them search the internet and find things that "turn them on and off" and then take the tamer things and try them r/l to see if the thought of em or the act of doing them is the same for both of them
<Northerner^> thank you
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> it took Franklin and i 10yrs together and then 18 mons apart to finally realize what our relationship was really about
<victoria_angel{Flint}> Skinger, for some it is pain, others unconditional control
<BernieRoehl> It *can* be about all of those things, Skinger. It can also be about the exchange of power and control.
* aliceinchains smiles and for some,,it is all of the above
* BernieRoehl nods at aliceinchains
<Skinger> being young and naive is bdsm the lead up to sex or not?
<BernieRoehl> For some people, BDSM is basically a type of foreplay
<Lancaster{d}> I believe it is
<fr0ggy> Skinger, it all depends on the person
<BernieRoehl> For others, it's an intrinsic part of who they are and how they relate to their partner(s)
<DarkAngel^{nym}> BDSM is many many things Skinger ,,,,,,,, it is whatever kink the people want to explore ,, not only pain ,, some has no pain,, D/s for example
<fr0ggy> I LIKE BDSM for the sake of BDSM
<fr0ggy> not including sex ..
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> that would be your choice Skinger
<fr0ggy> however..
<victoria_angel{Flint}> the sex can be more fulfilling for some with bdsm - the higher high..
<Skinger> darkangel could you tellme about d/s
<fr0ggy> if I were to be in a relationship with a partner who also enjoyed BDSM then i would hope to mix sex with it...
<Skinger> the natrual drug victoria?
<fr0ggy> exactly Skinger
<Lancaster{d}> I have a question
<victoria_angel{Flint}> Skinger, actually the mental level 'high' - for some it is a place where you go to feel total satisfaction - at what ever level that is for you
<BernieRoehl> Go ahead, Lancaster{d}
* DarkAngel^{nym} <---- includes sex but not casually
<Lancaster{d}> generally I have heard that the submissive sets the limits of her submission ,, is it ok or wrong for a Dom to demand a certain fetish or kink
<MsTiia> but you really don't even need sex in BDSM .... or at least some of us don't
<BernieRoehl> They can certainly exist separately. Some people even have sex without BDSM! (I know -- shocking, isn't it!) :-)
<SkyDom> Lancaster......one of the keywords is "consensual"....:)
<BernieRoehl> "demand" is a perhaps the wrong word, Lancaster{d}
<Skinger> Thank you MsTiia, I was not sure whether to look into this because sex was becoming boring to me and I love to nibble and bite
<SkyDom> Laff....Bernie....the world is full of freaks....:)
<MsTiia> yes, it is right but the sub should have the right to decide if he/she is willing to to accept that kink
<Lancaster{d}> understood SkyDom
<victoria_angel{Flint}> Lancaster, my Master has suggested another partner for years (+20), and i have yet to comply.....i have set limits which we have agreed upon - if the time is ever right - the person - etc., then it will happen
<BernieRoehl> There should always be some negotiation, Lancaster{d}
<victoria_angel{Flint}> no one will ever make me do more than i have agreed to
<Lancaster{d}> was only curious,,, i never demand anything
<victoria_angel{Flint}> however, some Dom/mes do....
<SkyDom> victoria_a ........not interested in nudging limits? Isn't that a bit unusual? -> *DarkAngel^{nym}* Hi! Can you update the automatic message to mention the topic? Some people have been asking me what it is. Thanks!
<kashina{MG}> that's part of the trust...that nothing will be pushed until the sub is ready to accept it...WITHOUT any emotional or psycological damage
<victoria_angel{Flint}> no, with other things, i have not set limits, or i have allowed even my limits to be exceeded....i have done this for years where both my Master and i have had fullfilling experiences
<janiz> and how does a sub deal with the... emtionally or mental..pain as it were....
<aliceinchains> as a lesson
<janiz> you talk abotu it..with your partner...but......
<victoria_angel{Flint}> a bad experience takes away trust, and once that happens, it is hard to find the ability to go ahead again for a while
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> tricky janiz
<Skinger> ??? is you master a life-partner usually?
* BernieRoehl notes (for people who have just joined in) that tonight is "newbie night" -- a chance for people new to BDSM to ask questions and (hopefully!) get answers
<SkyDom> Geez, janiz........I think that if there's any emotional or mental pain that lasts past the scene.....ya might be doing something wrong. Any opinions on that?
<janiz> .... it was... a fuck up ..that He admitted to....and ...i just couldnt get by it
* BernieRoehl has set up an automatic message to that effect
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> someone is doing something wrong do you have a check list janiz?
<janiz> autumn...i had been with this partner for over a year........
<kashina{MG}> if the Dom/me truly takes the time to know His/Her sub...they won't do anything to hurt them
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> do you have a checklist?
<janiz> i have done the checklist..a couple of times
<victoria_angel{Flint}> Skinger, my Master and i have determined we must be life-time partners because all of what we've been through, but not all are, some people need a new partner to grow and there is nothing wrong with that
<Lancaster{d}> mistakes may sometimes happen
<MsTiia> Yes, janiz .... who ever told you you that All Dom/mes are perfect .... we err sometimes .... depending on the error ... we can lose your trust
<Skinger> victoria, so some may be married to an other yet have a separte master
<BernieRoehl> Yes, Skinger -- that does happen
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> He is pushing you past your limits? then can you sit and speak with Him
<victoria_angel{Flint}> i have heard of that situation too....there are some whose spouse isn't able to fulfill the need of a master in the bdsm scene
<janiz> Ms. Tiia, that is what i have said to myself..everyone fucks up...but...it... is hard to get past
* aliceinchains raises her eyebrows,,dangerous waters
<KO_n_rhiannon> there are any number of experienced players out there that edge play with phobias and trust me that requires more that just a cuddle and a blanket after the scene as after care.....after care can go on for days after one of those scenes....and pls ppl do not try these scenes unless expereinced
<victoria_angel{Flint}> however, under those circumstances, the relationship must be very sound
<SkyDom> You're not talkin newbie there, KO
<janiz> KO..that is one...i got into knife play ..the last time...loved it....i dont need a lot of aftercare..immediately..but a few days later
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> along with trust ther should be a line of communication
<BernieRoehl> So... a question for the newbies. What is it that you feel draws you to BDSM?
<Skinger> victoria, thank you for you help tonight
<victoria_angel{Flint}> your welcome :) Skinger
<janiz> Bernie...the heat!!!!...
<Lancaster{d}> Bernie i have struggled with it my whole life ,, I wanted to loose it ,, I thought i was sick just up untill last year when I found these chat rooms
<aliceinchains> the honesty/trust/and honestly to myself regarding my own needs are what drew me,,
<fr0ggy> BernieRoehl : I like bondage..
<fr0ggy> I like D/s
* BernieRoehl nods
<Lancaster{d}> then i found out i was not the only one and that there was a whole world of this
<victoria_angel{Flint}> fr0ggy, i liked that too years ago without realizing i was a true submissive, that is from where i grew
<aliceinchains> also the facination of reaching "that next level"
<SkyDom> Bernie........I like to watch a woman struggle to get to her beer.....:)
<fr0ggy> victoria_angel{Flint} : i know i'm submissive..
<fr0ggy> but i'm also exploreing the fact that i may be a switch
<janiz> froggy..how do you know that?.....
<aliceinchains> what if she prefers a good Merlot to beer SkyDom?
<victoria_angel{Flint}> i tried only once to switch....it was not me
<fr0ggy> janiz, because in submission..
<janiz> i love the play..but im not sure im a submissive
<fr0ggy> i feel completely happy
<SkyDom> That'll do....:)
<fr0ggy> some aspects of my life are submissive.. others are Dominant..
<Lancaster{d}> loves watching a cute little red tush struggling to get away
<janiz> in submission?...sexually you mean..or ..on your knees getting coffee
<MsTiia> ... And when you A/all get out ot Munches or other events you will find out that that there are soooo many really "nice" folks who will make you realize that though you may be "unique" .... ther are many of U/s who are also!
<aliceinchains> your heart will tell you what your true self seeks once you open your mind
<butterflies4u> may i ask a question please?
* aliceinchains agrees the functions are great,,also very important as a new sub to touch base and talk to others
<fr0ggy> janiz : both...
<fr0ggy> submission in that
<_Zig_Zag> sure butterflies4u
<fr0ggy> it gives me pleasure
<BernieRoehl> Of course, butterflies4u
<fr0ggy> to give that control to another...
<fr0ggy> to trust them to control me
<fr0ggy> in other words
<fr0ggy> for the time of the play...
<fr0ggy> i let them guide me
<MsTiia> please butterflies .... go ahead
<butterflies4u> thanks _Zig_Zag....i am an exp. female sub...i have never been to a fet night...could i go by myself or do i have to go as a couple?
<_Zig_Zag> would be wise to be accompanied
<_Zig_Zag> in My op
<janiz> fair froggy
<BernieRoehl> You can go by yourself, but you'll feel more comfortable in a group
<fr0ggy> yeah
<MsTiia> Most fetish nights protect "lone" subs but do be careful or come with friends
<butterflies4u> thanks _Zig_Zag
<fr0ggy> more people to talk to
<jessyssej> unless you're a social butterfly
<fr0ggy> it was awkward my first night
<_Zig_Zag> welcome butterflies4u
<fr0ggy> I was there by my lonesome...
<fr0ggy> but everyone made me feel really welcome
<BernieRoehl> Depending on which fetnight you're planning to go to, many people from the channel or the mailing list will be there. I'm sure many of them would be happy to meet you for coffee beforehand so you don't have to show up alone.
<Lancaster{d}> was alone
<Lancaster{d}> i brought firestar to a munch because she did not want to go alone ,, then eventually she met someone for herself
<butterflies4u> i am very social...i just have Dom friends....and well...LOL don'y want to ask one of them heheheh
<janiz> i went to my first Munch alone...not knowing a soul..
<butterflies4u> BernieRoehl....that sounds cool
<Skinger> Janiz you are way braver than I am
<BernieRoehl> Actually, being there with a Dom would probably be a good choice butterflies4u
<butterflies4u> janiz...how was it..
<BernieRoehl> Are you on any of the local mailing lists, butterflies4u?
<janiz> ohhh..no im not..i needed...support..and had to find it quickly
<^Boo> it's great to be able to meet people from the chat rooms
<butterflies4u> yeah BernieRoehl...just that ...well...i am looking for a new Master and well..you know what i mean
<BernieRoehl> You may want to check out the EhBC page (www.ehbc.ca)
<MsTiia> Munches are not play nights and you don't tag yourself as Top or bottom and no one really cares ... it is just to meet like-minded individuals
<Skinger> Janiz I am normally a social butterfly when I am with people I know, without that I am a quiet person
<dalian> i remember going to my first munch alone too....was interesting
<janiz> Skinger.....im the one that always sits in the corner...im very shy
<butterflies4u> am on bdsm_toronto
<BernieRoehl> The first one is usually the hardest -- especially for people who come on their own
<BernieRoehl> After people come to a munch and realize it's just a bunch of interesting people sitting around eating and talking, they often wonder what they were so nervous about :-)
<dalian> i have now graduated from a corner to the middle
<Lancaster{d}> I went to about three munches and did not say a single word the whole time i was there
<janiz> im stilllike you Lancaster..and i have been going for almost a year
<Lancaster{d}> except ordering a drink
<Lancaster{d}> :)
<BernieRoehl> At most of the munches I go to, I try to make a point of saying hi to the new people
* aliceinchains smiles,,there is a lot to be said for sitting back and observing at both play parties and munches
<KO_n_rhiannon> couldnt have been Ehbc or Steelfet or London, Lancaster{d}
<arhiannah> and molesting the ones you do know...right Bernie? ;oP
<janiz> yes Bernie..You were intoduced to me...2 munches ago
* BernieRoehl chuckles
<BernieRoehl> Yup! :-)
<Skinger> aliceinchains, that is how i always treat new people, sit back watch and listen
<fr0ggy> and BernieRoehl, thanks for introducing yourself to me my first night out.. made me feel morcomfortable
<Lancaster{d}> one in London one in Kitchener and one in Hamilton
<BernieRoehl> My pleasure, fr0ggy
<KO_n_rhiannon> we all try and make a point of getting the new faces involved
<MsTiia> and I believe you met me too, froggy!
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> Franklin and i love to talk to newbies at munches
<fr0ggy> yes MsTiia I did :) and despite what you may have thought at the time.. lol I was just tired...
<fr0ggy> but thankyou none the less
<butterflies4u> me too Skinger....once i get to know people i open up...just quiet at first
<butterflies4u> it is killing me...not going you know...been a sub for 7 yrs and have never gone to any discussion groups or munches or fets
* butterflies4u stomps her feet!! i wanna go!...so...i am gonna !!
<butterflies4u> lol
<butterflies4u> dalian, what was it like?
<butterflies4u> am i lagged?
<Lancaster{d}> thinks the name newbies should be replaced
<nimeesha{JFC}> i have been lucky to have never had to go to a function alone...or i would never have gone.
<BernieRoehl> Good for you, butterflies4u
<BernieRoehl> A munch is literally just people sitting around having a bite to eat. We talk about BDSM occasionally, but also about lots of other things. -> [butterflies4u] PING
<BernieRoehl> Yup, butterflies4u -- but only by 10 seconds
<Skinger> MsTiia, when a "newbie" shows up at a munchie do they wear a "newbie"tag
* aliceinchains agrees with BernieRoehl very pleasent functions
<MsTiia> Okay butterflies .... Come on out ... and contrary to popular belief ,..... we don't bit ..... LOL
<dalian> it was intimidating at first...but the many ppl there were very welcoming and made me feel at home
<BernieRoehl> No, no tags required Skinger
<jessyssej> unless you want one
<_Zig_Zag> name tags BernieRoehl
<_Zig_Zag> lol
<aliceinchains> what starteled me was how not wierd we al look in a group
<BernieRoehl> We have name tags, but you can put whatever name you like on them (like "Skinger" for example) and no need to identify yourself as a newbie
<Skinger> I thought i heard someone say that people walk around with name tags?
<janiz> i suggested to Michael..to get me out and meet people i would....do the name tags at the next munch
* BernieRoehl nods at _Zig_Zag
* KO_n_rhiannon has to disagree with MsTiia, as he has bitten at a munch...but only after he was invited tooo
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> it is nice to have name tags though
<Skinger> yes please put a big red name tag on my forehead saying "NEWBIE & SCARED"
<MsTiia> LOL KO
<arhiannah> lol
* tawny^^{_ZZ} giggles.,
* butterflies4u is only a newbie to the events....lol
<butterflies4u> what should my tag say? lol
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> i always use breeze no Skinger just your nick then we says oh yeah your the newbie lol
* BernieRoehl smiles at Skinger
<Lancaster{d}> i have another question
<jessyssej> Skinger..i'm newer too...but incredibly glad that i bit the bullet and went to a munch....i can't get enough of them now
<BernieRoehl> Go ahead, Lancaster{d}
<MsTiia> I went to amunch the other day and "pouted" that they did not give me a name tag .... did no good .... said everyone knew me anyway ....lol
<Lancaster{d}> I have yet to use a flogger but have been told it is softer than the hand or paddle
<BernieRoehl> It depends on a lot of things, Lancaster{d}
* KO_n_rhiannon thinks that he would rather bite flesh that dme der bullets jessie <EG>
<BernieRoehl> The weight of the flogger, the number and thickness of the strands in the fall, and how much force you put behind it
<Lancaster{d}> I just ordered a lambskin one from leathersmith
<jessyssej> KO_n_rhiannon..i too would rather have bitten flesh..but there was none around that day :)
<BernieRoehl> That's a good choice, Lancaster{d}. And my recommendation would be to get familiar with that one flogger first, before moving on to another.
<MsTiia> l;ambskin ..... ooooo ... you are going to spoil your sub!
<Lancaster{d}> leathersmith is going to show me how to use it first
<BernieRoehl> Make sure you read up on where to land the strokes and where not to. In particular, avoid the neck and the kidneys.
<BernieRoehl> That's good, Lancaster{d} -- always better to learn from a person than from a book
<Lancaster{d}> MsTiia I love to spoil the ladies treat them like princess`
<MsTiia> Wonderful .... all new impllements should be practised on a teddy bear or pillow!
<janiz> i would like to thank Yyou for Yyour time.....enjoy
<Lancaster{d}> prefers just the but and the sweetspot where the lges meet the tush
<BernieRoehl> Good target area, Lancaster{d}. Even if you just focus on that area, you'll be doing great!
<_Zig_Zag> Lancaster U will learn with experience that there r many delicious spots on the female form...
<_Zig_Zag> causing different sensations with diffeent toys
<BernieRoehl> Very true, _Zig_Zag!
<_Zig_Zag> like how many Dom/Domme work the soles of the feet?
<_Zig_Zag> under the breast?
<Lancaster{d}> Zig_Zag I deffinatly love the breasts but for now only pinch the nipple,, and the tummy but prefer to tickle taht
<_Zig_Zag> even armpits
<_Zig_Zag> lol
<_Zig_Zag> well tickle well freind
<fr0ggy> BernieRoehl, when you have a second.. may I pm please?
<BernieRoehl> Sure, go ahead fr0ggy
<_Zig_Zag> howdy KO_n_rhiannon
<Lancaster{d}> under the breast?
<_Zig_Zag> sure very tender to a crop
<Lancaster{d}> hhmmm
<_Zig_Zag> lift the breast, or even crop the nipples
<Lancaster{d}> do all submissives end up liking more and more pain
<_Zig_Zag> I enjoy trying to find new spots on tawny that will bring that sweet sound of her sharp breathe intake
<_Zig_Zag> thats when I know it hurts
<arhiannah> personally, Lancaster{d}...i've discovered that the pain that used to be enough...isn't anymore
<_Zig_Zag> some do but not all
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> for me i pain tolerance has increased
<BernieRoehl> So, five minutes left in our official discussion time
<_Zig_Zag> some r pain sluts others r senous sluts
<BernieRoehl> Any newbies have questions they'd like to ask before we wrap up?
<Lancaster{d}> Zig Zag what do you mean sensuos slut
<tawny^^{_ZZ}> ��arhiannah�� true the more you play it increases.
<MsTiia> sorry A/all got booted
<_Zig_Zag> wb MsTiia
<_Zig_Zag> Lancaster{d} some like differnt sensations softness with flogging
<_Zig_Zag> or the use of toys that don't nessicarily hurt
<Lancaster{d}> that`s desire
<_Zig_Zag> but not pain
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> sensations that can put a senuous sub into subbie zone
<autumn`breeze{JFC}> and still please her Master
<_Zig_Zag> egg. tawny when I work on her , will take a beating and love it, yet the longer I work her and harder the more intense it gets, painfully and pleasurablly
<Lancaster{d}> this Master is pleased when his partner is happy
<BernieRoehl> Well, it's 10 pm so I'm going to close the log and wrap up the format part of the discussion
<BernieRoehl> Please feel free to continue chatting, though, and asking questions.
<_Zig_Zag> or I can turn around, tie her down and flogg her with light soft feathery stokes
<BernieRoehl> Thanks to everyone who participated -- both with questions, and with answers!
<SkyDom> Ya don't always have to inflict pain.....I've had subs who wanted nothing to do with pain....but you don't need to use pain to torture.......pleasure works just as well.....:)
* `vixie does her wave hello now