January 30 2000 EhBC Online Discussion
<TechnoMage`> Hi A/all...
<Kilted_One> "Can a Sub Be Too Possessive"
* `lil^bear` giggles..ummm Sir..bear is dizzy enough eh
<bottoms_up{RD}> oh i forgot.. the discussion *sitting quietly*
<swannie^^> When i agreed to lead this talk i had many feelings
on the subject...
<`zee{LQ}> if i may... i found this topic odd in that all people
can be too possessive..is it any different for a submissive?
<shadodancer> a sub in my opinion.....is human....and most
humans are capable of possessiveness
<swannie^^> watching the antics of irc and chat subs and Dom/mes
<swannie^^> i recognized that there was a way of behaving online
that was often different from r/t but mirrored it
* `zee{LQ} listens
* Kilted_One has set auto msg to on
<swannie^^> beling jealous and possessive have all different
manners of manifestation
<swannie^^> but
<swannie^^> in my opinion all route from the same source...
<swannie^^> lack of communication, lack of self esteem and
looking to others to make you whole ....
<swannie^^> these are my opinions and now i wish to hear yours
....
<shadodancer> or just plain insecurity in the relationship
<`zee{LQ}> imho.. jealousy and possessiveness are reactionary
emotions stemming from fears and insecurities within that person or of
the relationship
<swannie^^> please listen to othe others
<elbowfetish> A subbie may want to be with you 24/7, dress you,
in the bathroom, possessive possibly from insecurity or dependence, more
than in a vanilla relationship.
* bottoms_up{RD} is interested in this discussion because i am
too far the other way.. and have been accused of being cold cause i
wasnt jealous, etc
<elbowfetish> bottoms: I get the same thing, no emotional
outburst so people get upset.
<swannie^^> then i must ask ........why do you think it's more
than a vanilla relationship
<shadodancer> imo...jealousy and possessiveness is showing a
lack of trust in ones partner.....bdsm or vanilla
<swannie^^> don't we hear of stalking and murders of
spouses.....
<Life_Quester> elbowfetish, bottoms...yet you communicate in
other forms I suspect.
<Kilted_One> or maybe "an ability to trust" shado??
<shadodancer> how so KO?
<elbowfetish> The depencence can be intensified in a D/s
relationship.
<shadodancer> ah ...got it....definitely KO
<bottoms_up{RD}> ohhh i am very verbal, etc.. just very open to
others.. friends, family, lovers, etc... since i am not possessive at
all.. i am cold
<Kilted_One> well there is a difference is not trusting and not
being able to trust I think shado
<shadodancer> understood KO
* LrdThomas isn't sure what is meant by "too possessive"... but
if it means jealous, or seeking to control in various subtle ways, or
seeks to decide what her master can and can't do, ... then yes, she can
be too possessive.
<`lil^bear`> being jealous and possessive is part of human
nature, damn we are jealous of the Jones because they got a new car, or
jealous of the sub wearing a collar..I think it is naturla however its
when these natural tendencies turn into some more intense that we need
to concern ourselves with..when it becomes stalking..or harassment...
<elbowfetish> Has anyone been subbie-stalked?
<`lil^bear`> and I dont think..that it is just on the part of a
sub..Doms can also be too possessive
<shadodancer> very true bear
<LrdThomas> whether jealousy is "natural" or "nurtured" is a
topic for the socilogists.... all i know, is it's a destructive evil
emotion.
<bottoms_up{RD}> agreed bear
<swannie^^> `lil^bear` but this topic is about subs not the
Dom/mes
<elbowfetish> But aren't Dom's allowed to be more possessive, in
some ways?
<`slutkat`> no
<bottoms_up{RD}> not in my books
<`lil^bear`> but it shouldnt be..it shoud be..can anyone be too
possessive...
<shadodancer> people in general can be possessive
<swannie^^> well bear please present that for another time
<`lil^bear`> this is not just a sub issue...
<`zee{LQ}> if a sub is possessive is it seen as 'topping from
the bottom' or simply someone who has a possessive nature>?
<Kilted_One> thinks that `lil^bear` can do that topic later ;)
<`lil^bear`> its a person issue..that we all experience whether
it is due to low sefl esteem or insecurites
<shadodancer> can also be insecurity tho zee
<swannie^^> bear we hear you but would you please stay on topic
<swannie^^> we can look at that topic for another time
<elbowfetish> Not topping from the bottom so much as "clinging"
sometimes.
<`lil^bear`> this is on topis..
<`lil^bear`> topic even
* `lil^bear` shuts up..sticks her nose back in her books
<`slutkat`> lol
<sunni-2000> lol....li'l bear
<`Rodent`> hmmm full house tonite
<`Rodent`> hullo room
<Life_Quester> is it not a responsibility of the Master to purge
baggage from the sub....thereby eliminating the character "flaws" that
might spawn possessiveness?
<ania> hi :)
<LrdThomas> jea;loust and possessiveness can be overcome in a
sub by her master, by teaching her how treasured and valued she is to
him, that in time creates a foundation of an even larger trust that
allows for "extra" play if that is what the master wants.
<bottoms_up{RD}> purge baggage from the sub? *giggles* ..
thinking the Master should be a phsyco anyalist ;)
<shadodancer> interesting concept Life_Quester
<goldcharm> Life_Quester, i have found few Dom with the skill
set to accomplish that
<SirLancelot`> are you saying that a Master can totally change a
subs character?
* `lil^bear` erases what she wrote..convinces herself to study
and stay out of it
<SirLancelot`> lol lilbear
<Life_Quester> bottoms_up{RD}...I was NOT being cute.
<elbowfetish> Nurturing helps.
<^^Thorn> hello all
<swannie^^> okay then let me ask this question ....
<elbowfetish> Someone can be too possesive because of past
baggage, and learn to overcome that with trust.
<swannie^^> is it the subs right to be possessive
<Life_Quester> goldcharm....but the effort MUST be
extended....if there is to be a true D/s relationship.
<bottoms_up{RD}> LifeQuester, i am sorry. i do not think of a
Master as a dr of phsychology. if i needed therapy i would seek a
qualified dr. ;)
<goldcharm> i agree wholeheartedly Life_Quester SIr
<elbowfetish> You can mold a sub's character, but it usually
bounces back eventually. :-)
<shadodancer> effort from both sides
<`zee{LQ}> i agree with Life_Quester and LrdThomas Sirs in that
a Master seeing the problem of His sub can help her to feel more secure
and voice her emotions in order to help her
<LrdThomas> it is a subs right to expect her master to abide by
the committments he made to her is all swannie.
<Life_Quester> elbowfetish...agrees totally.
<swannie^^> or him zee
<swannie^^> understood Sir ...but what if that sub is in a poly
relationship .....
<`zee{LQ}> of course swannie^^ him/her
<swannie^^> arranged in advance...
<swannie^^> and then gets jealous and possessive....
<swannie^^> is she/he abiding by the original agreement
<shadodancer> then she shouldn't be there swannie....in my
opinion
<elbowfetish> poly makes possessiveness more complicated for
sure.
<Life_Quester> poly...the match of the chemistry is needed to be
almost perfect...and that is incumbent on the Master
<swannie^^> and does she have the right to renegotiate if she/he
is slave
<`abi> not always possible to change it shado
<`zee{LQ}> you have to alwayys look to the root of those
feelings..why she/he has them and address them...the reasons not the
reactions.
<bottoms_up{RD}> some people get involved in something they
think they can handle.. but when faced with the reality of it... find it
isnt right for her
<LrdThomas> then she can abide her mmasters teachings her why
that is destructive to them, why her fears are unfounded... and if she
can't in time learn that, then i expect she will be given ample
opportunity to reconsider her need to be in service to him.
* Life_Quester smiles at `zee....yes....looking at the
casues...the the manifestations.
<shadodancer> abi...everyone has choices
<elbowfetish> Lack of growth is death, rules and amount of
posessiveness will change over time.
<|Karen> shado...some people give up those choices when they
enter the relationsip
<swannie^^> please elaborate what you mean elbow ..
<`lil^bear`> agreed elbowfetish...
<Life_Quester> |Karen....but the choices do not go away....just
the power in who has responsibility for them
<shadodancer> i don't believe they do Karen......no Master worth
anything is going to keep a submissive in a relationship that is harming
them
<elbowfetish> A sub may abrogate to a Master some control over
the change, but a relationship will grow, or shrivel.
<SirLancelot`> Some lose the choice due to cercumstances beyond
their control
* |Karen disagrees, believes in TPE
<`zee{LQ}> as in love SirLancelot` Sir? is that what You mean
circumstances beyond their control
<SirLancelot`> sorta zee
<shadodancer> TPE does not allow for harming another emotionally
Karen
<elbowfetish> Karen believes in TPE now but didn't always, and
may not in future.
<SirLancelot`> like being in a relationship and then finding out
what you are.
<SirLancelot`> a commitment that's already been made.
<swannie^^> okay |Karen what about the sub that enters a
relationship and then finds out the Master is married .....a very common
theme
<|Karen> please don't speak to what I do or do not believe,
elbowfetish. you do not know my mind
<Life_Quester> love does not defuse the D/s
responsibilities....it intensifies them
<SirLancelot`> one hopes
<Life_Quester> more than hopes Sir....
* bottoms_up{RD} found with possessive people in my life.. i do
not let their actions cross my lines... demanding i not do this or do
that, etc. and over time, with constant 'love' and attention, the person
learns that there is no need for holding onto me so tight, afraid to
lose me, etc
<`lil^bear`> if a sub enters a relations and THEN finds out the
Master is married..obviously the Master hasnt been totally honest with
her..hence some distrust in the relationship..hence some possessiveness
and jealousy
<swannie^^> but what if it's a TPE relationship and she/he feels
they may not feel jealous and/or possessive .....
<shadodancer> not *some* distrust bear....total distrust
<elbowfetish> Does a Master have to explain everything then?
<`lil^bear`> honesty or lack of is usually the first thing to
cause distrust...which in turn is going to cause some possessiveness...
<bottoms_up{RD}> agreed bear
<SirLancelot`> Yes HE does elbowfetish
* LrdThomas won't comment on the sub finding out her master is
married.... that is too unbelievably stupid for me.... on both parties.
<`lil^bear`> no a Master doesnt have to explain everything...but
damn being married and not telling a sub..thats a BIG bit of infor to
withhold
<ania> agree lil
<shadodancer> that is deceipt....pure & simple
<swannie^^> Sir ...with all due respects there are many reasons
why it can happen
<swannie^^> exactly lil
<`lil^bear`> all relations are based on honesty, no matter what
kind of relationship it is.....D/s or vanilla...if a Master has given a
sub reason to be jealous or possessive then obviously there was a lack
of communication somewhere
<LrdThomas> not telling a sub he is married, is not part of the
lifestyle i know as "responsible power exchange". it is "wetting your
dick at any expense". :(
<Kilted_One> anyone who enters into a TPE relationship I would
"hope" would know if their mate's status.....is getting confused with
that line of thought, would seem that ppl are forgetting how intense and
trusting a TPE relationship really is
<elbowfetish> I believe in Total Honesty Exchange myself, eases
lots of possessivenes problems. :-)
<|Karen> it would be incrediably brainless to enter a TPE
without having full confidence and trust in the Dom...and that doesn't
happen when there is withheld information
* bottoms_up{RD} smiles to elbow fetish :)
<`zee{LQ}> though it is not always a 'reason' to be possessive
`lil^bear`.. sometimes it is just that person's own fears from past
experiences
<swannie^^> umm people ....
<|Karen> has anyone ever heard of courting before commitment?
<SirLancelot`> agreed elbowfetish
<swannie^^> when there is withheald information
<swannie^^> the people don't know
<swannie^^> it's withheld ...
<Life_Quester> if the Master cannot inspire trust...and
continually earn that trust...then he is a pretender...not a Master.
<LrdThomas> zactly LQ.
<`lil^bear`> LrdThomas In a perfect world you are correct...all
should be told..however this is not a perfect world..and I have heard of
subs being hurt due to not being told the dom was married or had another
slave..or was already in a relations..hence how can the dom or master
expect the sub to not be possessive ?
<shadodancer> what happens when it comes out swannie??
* `zee{LQ} nods in agreement
<swannie^^> i agree Life_Quester Sir
* `lil^bear` nods in agreemetn with Life_Quester
<swannie^^> depends on the situation shado
* ^brat tries to gather the cookies she just lost and leaves
<swannie^^> but trust definately is lost
<swannie^^> not sure it would result necessarily in
possessiveness or jealously for all
<Life_Quester> rti...
<elbowfetish> But if there's trust, you don't have to explain
everything.
<`zee{LQ}> yes Master
<shadodancer> just my opinion but if someone were to withhold
that type of information from me then that person has shown distrust in
me
<|Karen> why would anyone enter even a simple D/s relationship
without first finding out that one's partner is married, or poly?
<`lil^bear`> and as soon as trust is lost...the relationship
starts to fail...all these things we are disussing, possessiveness
jealousy..become more real
<goldcharm> but then the next Dom is left with that baggage..and
the line i get is "don't hold against Me what someOne else did to you"
<LrdThomas> lilk bear, the sub should not be absolved of all
responsiblity for not knowing he was married. I am not condoning the
wannabe dom, but the sub needs to shake her head if she offered herself
to someone she knew so little about.
* |Karen agrees with LT
<`lil^bear`> agreed LrdThomas however it does happen...and the
subs are not without blame
<bottoms_up{RD}> here here LT ;)
<|Karen> no kidding.
<|Karen> it's called personal responsibility
<|Karen> subs have it too
<`zee{LQ}> goldcharm sis... it is hard to keep the scars out of
the new chances...
<elbowfetish> Who'se more posessive, young virgin subs, or more
experienced ones?
<swannie^^> i would never take a collar without first having a
mentor to help me make the right choices...
* `lil^bear` will never take a collar lol
* Kilted_One thinks that never is a looooong time ;)
<elbowfetish> But your Dom should be your mentor.
<`zee{LQ}> elbowfetish..tis not a matter of experience in D/s...
possessiveness is a trait in that person...
<LrdThomas> the sub who hears ""don't hold against Me what
someOne else did to you" deserves to hear that. and then the new
prospective master should say, now lets move on with getting to know
each other.
<`lil^bear`> damn elbowfetish thats a tough question...
* bottoms_up{RD} would geuss newbies are..the feeling is so new
and powerful.. they cling onto someone more?
<elbowfetish> Not that more than one mentor is a bad idea.
<`abi> I'm not sure that possessiveness or jealousy can always
be anticipated
* Kilted_One thinks that the level of possesiveness will vary
with the individuals and the circumstances
<shadodancer> a mentor is not always one's Master
* `lil^bear` is not sure if even as a newbie she was
possessive..and knows at this point in her life..that she is definitely
not the jealous or possessive type..
* `zee{LQ} agrees with Kilted_One Sir
<swannie^^> i don't think you can generalize
<`abi> circumstances being a critical factor KO
* swannie^^ is not jealous nor possessive .....but by some's
definition ...i am incredably stupid
<elbowfetish> Is posessiveness all negative? Who thinks their
subs aren't possessive enough?
* bottoms_up{RD} smiles to bear
* Kilted_One nods
<`zee{LQ}> exactly swannie^^.. it is an individual thing..some
never are. and some always are.. and others are within certian
experiences
* `lil^bear` giggles..thinks of her conversation on the way
home..and knows she is not possessive enough...
<swannie^^> i think this topic is a good opening for the more
important topic that lil-bear brought up originally.....
<swannie^^> is there a place for possessive behavior in ANY
relationship and by ANY partner in the relationship
* Kilted_One thinks that the level of possesiveness and jealousy
is inversly proportional to the level of comfort at any given time
within a relationship
<shadodancer> very true KO
<elbowfetish> There is an optimal level of posessiveness, on
both sides.
<swannie^^> i would run from a relationship where there is
possessiveness....
<SirLancelot`> everything has a balance...I don't think that a
total lack of possessiveness is good either
* Kilted_One thinks that if comfort is offence, then jealousy is
defence
* LrdThomas is very possessive.... of his morning coffee. <g>
<`lil^bear`> to an extend swannie^^ i think there is...i think a
lil bit of possessiveness is a good thing..its when it gets out of hand
that it becomes a problem to be dealt with..if i was with a Dom that had
me stick continuously by his side at a munch or social gathering..then
that to be would be way to possessive...cause bears a social
butterfly..however to know that a Dom is there watching over me...with a
lil bit of possessiveness is a good thing...its a fine line i think
<bottoms_up{RD}> possesive brings to mind a possession.. and to
me a person can truly never be a possesion.. Dom or sub. so there isnt
any optimum level, in my eyes.
<`zee{LQ}> imho.. possessivenss is a relative thing.. there is a
scale where it is deemed cute-----------> dangerous
* shadodancer makes note never to steal LrdThomas' coffee
<`lil^bear`> agrred `zee{LQ}
<`zee{LQ}> why is that bottoms_up{RD}?
<shadodancer> definitely zee...and if it's dangerous then what?
<bottoms_up{RD}> we are not inanimate objects that you can
possess, zee
* Kilted_One chuckles and think that LT is a lil more possesive
with some other things to ;)
<`lil^bear`> if its dangerous then time to re assess the
siutation...open up the lines of communication...
<shadodancer> ya think KO :)
<`zee{LQ}> if the Master can allieve the fears that are causing
it..than all the better, if not in due time..He is best to leave the
relationship
<bottoms_up{RD}> agreed zee
<swannie^^> trust me lil ...when it gets to dangerous ..there is
no place for talking ...only running
<`abi> but people can "belong" bottoms, in many ways...and when
that is threatened, in reality or in perception, then possessiveness and
jealousy are natural reactions
<SirLancelot`> lol swannie
<SirLancelot`> your right though
* Life_Quester HATES to abandon a quest....even such as the one
you are speaking of `zee
* `lil^bear` smiles..yes swannie bear is well aware of the
danger level in possession....
<shadodancer> ah but Life_Quester.....sometimes that is the best
for all involved
<bottoms_up{RD}> i guess abi, i will have to look into that more
;)
* LrdThomas possesses his slave... and that in no way shape or
form dimishes her. And if one thinks so, be prepared to do battle with
her strength. :))
<swannie^^> or abi ....are those feelings truly possessiveness
and jealously or are they pain and fear ...or any other combination of
emotions
<Life_Quester> shadodancer...no argument really...but I guess I
take this too seriously at times....to enhance the lot of the sub....
* SirLancelot` wonders if bottoms doesn't refer to RD as "her
Master"?
<bottoms_up{RD}> i give my time, attention, love or whatever to
people in my life.. they do not possess me.
<shadodancer> oh i see no problem with that Life_Quester.....but
there are times when to remain only causes hate
* `lil^bear` applauds bottoms_up{RD}
<`abi> well swann...I'm not a jealous or possessive
person...I've only experienced them once in my life ... pain and fear
were part of it certainly....but they certainly manifested themselves as
possessiveness and jealousy
* `zee{LQ} tests her posts
<Life_Quester> shadodancer....sadly I can see where that can
evolve.
<bottoms_up{RD}> sometimes Lancelot *Grin* ... but as i said, i
give myself to him at this point.. he doesnt possess me.. to me their is
a difference
<shadodancer> a sad situation Life_Quester.....but one that
cannot continue
<swannie^^> *nodding*
<pinksilk> smiling warmly..greetings all
<SirLancelot`> good bottoms..I'm saying that there is a certain
amount of pride and possessiveness in the phrase "My Master" - and it's
a balanced equation.
<SirLancelot`> visa versa is true too
* `zee{LQ} nods agreeing with SirLancelot` on the pride
<swannie^^> okay ....so lets stop for a minute
<swannie^^> please
<swannie^^> what this discussion has shown
<swannie^^> is
* `lil^bear` wiggles her toes
<swannie^^> 1 possessive behavior is not sub or Dom/me or Bdsm
only
<swannie^^> it's human
<elbowfetish> In a Master/Slave relationship the slave is the
owned, that's one reason possessiveness is an issue in a sub.
<OT> true
<swannie^^> 2. there are levels of bdsm where possessiveness by
the Dom/me is appropriate ....
* `zee{LQ} nods
<swannie^^> and he/she has a responsiblity to see if the
sub/slave is feeling uncomfortable and deal with it
<swannie^^> by helping etc..
<swannie^^> 3. trust leads to feelings that enhance
relationships and discourage those emotions which people feel are
negative
* pinksilk slips from the channel... bye
<swannie^^> 4. absense of those emotions can be seen as negative
as well
<swannie^^> welcome back abi
<swannie^^> have i caught all the major points people have made
here tonight?
<swannie^^> *tapping on the screen* ......anybody awake?
<elbowfetish> Does swannie feel posessive about the discussion?
<`zee{LQ}> did a good job swannie^^
<LrdThomas> well, you missed St. Louis long bomb touchdown a
moment ago. <g>
* `lil^bear` giggles at elbowfetish
<shadodancer> good synopsis swannie
<swannie^^> elbow do you think swannie feels possessive about
the discussion?
* shadodancer steals LrdThomas' channel converter
* elbowfetish thinks it's a good thing.
<swannie^^> *smile* well Sir ...since i don't wanch hockey i
would not know
<swannie^^> hocky
<shadodancer> lol swannie^^
* `zee{LQ} laughs
<swannie^^> teasing i know it's football
<`lil^bear`> LrdThomas can bear msg ya to find out the score
please?
<`zee{LQ}> smooth swannie^^ smooth!
<`slutkat`> whats score?
<swannie^^> anybody have anything they would like to add?
<elbowfetish> Who gets upstet when Master abandons them for
hockey?
<shadodancer> football swannie...aka tight ends :)
<`slutkat`> 23/16
<swannie^^> YUM
<`slutkat`> got it
<`lil^bear`> for who?
<swannie^^> can we make them into wide recievers
<`slutkat`> rams/titans
<lexical> What's the topic tonight?
<`zee{LQ}> i would like to ask the Dom/mes a question on the
topic
<swannie^^> go for it zee
*LrdThomas* 23-16 St. Luois 1 minute to go.
* SirLancelot` looks at zee
<`zee{LQ}> do they enjoy their subs to be a little
possessive..do They see a none possessive submissive as one that
consents to something?
*LrdThomas* you wilcum. :)
<elbowfetish> It's good and bad, at the same time. :-)
<SirLancelot`> accessive possessiveness is bad
<elbowfetish> Some posessiveness is very ego building. Too much
is a pain.
<SirLancelot`> possessiveness in moderation is GREAT!!!
<`zee{LQ}> sometimes i had worried that void of those jealousy
possessive emtions..that some would take it as a green light..not
thinking that there are other concerns or emotions besides them
* Kilted_One likes balance in all things but settle for the
things that can be controlled at any given time in the
relationship....not just possesiveness
<LrdThomas> not at all sure what you are asking zee.
* `zee{LQ} nods to Kilted_One Sir and SirLancelot` Sir
<`lil^bear`> W|cked says...a little bit of possessivenss is
understood ..but...no he doesnt belive that it is consenting to
anything...there is a lil possessiveness on both parts...
<`zee{LQ}> do You Sir like it when You feel from Your one that
she is feeling possessive of You?
* `zee{LQ} nods and smiles to Wicked Sir
<LrdThomas> i like when she deomonstrably shows her appreciation
of being my slave.
* Life_Quester sees the need in His slave's eyes as saying a
great deal....mor ethan any overt act of "possessiveness" could.
<bottoms_up{RD}> Wicked.. ya still there? ;)
<swannie^^> zee no matter what any of the other Dom/mes answer
...it's Life_Quester who's response you seek
<`lil^bear`> lol bottoms_up{RD} hes eaten..
* `zee{LQ} smiles to swannie^^
* `lil^bear` checks the subbie hand book..nope doesnt say
nuthing bout feeding no Dom
* Life_Quester smiles at swannie^^
* `lil^bear` takes his food away
<bottoms_up{RD}> lol bear
<`zee{LQ}> this slave knows her Master's response already sis!
<swannie^^> *smile* i'm sure she does ...
* swannie^^ hugs zee
* `zee{LQ} hugs her back
<`zee{LQ}> it is hard to put the thoughts into words.. but here
goes
<`zee{LQ}> if there is no jealousy shown or seen..no
possessivness shown or seen.. that doesn't mean that there is a green
light with something..just that person shows their emtions another way
* `zee{LQ} hopes she makes sense... some of the time..lol
<swannie^^> you did zee
<shadodancer> it did zee
<swannie^^> thank you
<`zee{LQ}> i did?? lol
<swannie^^> well thank you everybody for participating in this
discussion ..
* `lil^bear` giggles at `zee{LQ}
<elbowfetish> Showing it and feeling it are 2 different things.
<shadodancer> thx swannie :)
<LrdThomas> thank you swannie. :) koc
<`lil^bear`> thanks swannie...
<`zee{LQ}> wonders never cease...see Master.. You are helping
Your slut!
<elbowfetish> If there isn't any posessiveness inside, there's
no relationship.
<bottoms_up{RD}> who ever heard of that poem thingy.. about set
it free, if its yours it comes back to you, etc etc? There is no need
for possession or jealousy
<shadodancer> goes along with trust bottoms_up
<bottoms_up{RD}> i dont agree elbowfetish, but then i am weird
*smiles*
<`zee{LQ}> i disagree elbowfetish... but that is what makes life
interesting
<swannie^^> can't always tell the heart that bottoms_up{RD}
<SkyDom> Best Super Bowl 've ever seen.
<lexical> bottoms_up{RD} IS weird.
<`slutkat`> yeeehawww
<SkyDom> oooops
<`lil^bear`> aww but bottoms_up{RD} how many times do you set it
free..and allow it to come back?
<swannie^^> GO EXPOS!!!!!
* `slutkat` has never seen any of em...
* bottoms_up{RD} fwaps lexi! lol
* `zee{LQ} laughs
<`lil^bear`> brb k